June 19, 2024

ANZCVS Membership Oral Exam Last-Minute Pep Talk

ANZCVS Membership Oral Exam Last-Minute Pep Talk
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This little bonus episode is for a very select audience of brave souls who have already completed the written part of their Australia New Zealand College Of Veterinary Scientists membership exams, and are due to sit oral exams in a few week’s time. It's made from snippets of conversation about how to get into the right head space for the oral exams, with tips on last minute preparation, and what to expect in the actual exam.

Our guests are specialist surgeons and former examiners Dr Chris Tan and Dr Mark Newman, and former membership candidates Dr Justin Ward and Dr Stephen Mansour, and they deliver on the nuggets of wisdom that might help get you over the line. (Or at least stop you from wetting your pants on exam day!)

The vet school in South Africa where I qualified honest support, is in a city called Pretoria.Pretoria's nickname is the Jacaranda City because in early summer, the Jacaranda trees that line many of the city streets explode in a purple haze that beautifies and perfumes the neighbourhoods.
It's a happy time for most, But if you're a student, it's a very clear signal that exams are just around the corner.And what are you doing outside?Because you should be studying.I still can't see or smell a Jacaranda blossom without my adrenals giving me a reflex panicked squirt of adrenaline.
I don't know what the signal is here in Australia, but winter time means exam time for a select group of brave souls who have opted to sit there.Australia New Zealand College of Veterinary Scientists membership exams, and you're probably one of them if you decided to hit play.This is a little bonus episode for a very select audience of people who have already completed the written part of their membership exams and are due for oral examinations in a few weeks time.
I made it from snippets of conversation with specialist surgeons and previous examiners Doctor Chris Tan and Doctor Mark Newman and previous membership candidates Doctor Steven Mansell and Dr. Justin Ward.And we made it because I thought that there are a few Nuggets here that might help get you over the line or at least stop you from wetting your pants on exam day.
Hope it helps, and if you've listened this far and you're not sitting for oral exams in July but you know somebody who is, do them a favor and send them a link to this.They warn you, but the oral is really daunting.
And again, as you know, I love to talk.I can, I'm pretty confident I can talk to anyone, but I really froze up during those orals.I'll say this from experiences, both an examinee and examiner in the oral exam, that the examiners are there not to try and stump you, not to try and trick you.
They just want to try and assess how much information you have in your brain and can you manage the cases that are in front of you appropriately without killing the animal.Can you do the appropriate treatment that is required?So they'll ask leading questions to try and get that information out of you.
They don't want to stump you or trick you.The hardest part though, is that as they're asking these questions, they're going to be sitting there very, very Stony faced.They shouldn't crack a smile, give you a nod or a shake of a head or any kind of verbal or visual indicator that you're doing the right or the wrong thing.
And that's really, really off putting for a lot of people to be, you know, just basically talking to a stone statue who's got the, you know, the power of life and death in their hands.It really took them by surprise because the examiners can give you nothing.Their faces are just deadpan.
They can't encourage you.They can't smile.They can't say, yeah, that's great.Anything else, they nothing.They just stare at you.So just go in, prepare for that.Prepare for that, practice for that.To to not expect them to act like your friends.
They're not there to kind of, you know, give you a pat on the back at the start, but they are just trying to get out the information they have in your brain without leading you too much in one way or the other.So that's why they they act very impressive and Stony faced is they don't want to direct your answers.
They want you to come up with your information.But if they laugh at your answer, not a good sign.Any any laughter or tears are generally not a good sign.And I I've heard of multiple times where friends or colleagues will have given their answer for one part of the the oral exam and perhaps it's incorrect or or different and then you reveal more information as the examiner and how, how have you had to deal with that or suggest dealing with that?
That's really common.So you know, you might get a question and you'll be asked to come up with a list of diagnostic modalities to to investigate.And you say, I'm going to do diagnostic modality A and then the next slide they'll turn around and say, well, we did diagnostic modality B and that's OK.
Don't don't beat yourself up when that happens.You may still have got marks for choosing what you chose, but it may just not be what was actually performed in that one particular case.And it doesn't mean that you're going to lose out marks for the rest of the that oral question, that oral scenario.
So you can be wildly different to what the examiners did, but you can still pick up the rest of the marks going forward because, you know, what you've said in the first half doesn't actually change the marks you can pick up in the second part of that oral question.So, yeah, it's very common that people say one thing, the examiner say another thing, and then they just breakdown because they think I've stuffed everything up.
Just smile and nod and move on and answer the next question as best you can.Mark, I think that's great advice.It's like being in the moment and being present.If you spend that oral exam pondering what you should have said 3 minutes ago or thinking about how you stuffed up that question 5 minutes ago, you won't be answering that question that is currently being asked as well as you could possibly do.
So I think once you've answered it, you really move on to the next question.Pay full attention to the question they're asking.And much like the written, you answer the question that they've asked.Don't just go off on a tangent with what you want to talk about, you know, answer the question that they've asked.
And so I'd always recommend before the oral exam that you practice with your mentor in just articulating, you know, clearly your answer because it's a, it is a different technique to the, the written or the the typed exam.So I think that's important not to let it all unwind.
If you feel like you've answered one question inappropriately, there's there's always a way to to to get through that.But also remember that, you know, there's in a lot of what we do, there's more than one option that is correct.I think I remember when I was setting my membership exams, I was presented with a, a radiograph of a dog with a fracture.
And they after a bit of talking, they said, how would you like to treat this fracture?And I said I would place a bone plate and then the next slide was fracture fixed with an external fixator.The bone plate wasn't the wrong option.It was just not what was done.And then I could still pick up those marks talking through an external fixator on the next slide.
But you do get a bit of a kick in the gut when you see the the next slide.There's something different to what you've said, but it doesn't mean you're wrong.And as Chris said, it's really important not to dwell on it.Get it out of your brain and just focus on the questions that are in front of you.For people that are not used to speaking in clinical language that is expected in the exam.
Did either of you use any Jedi mind tricks before your exam or or any practice techniques to to get in the zone of doing that?I don't know about Jedi mind tricks, but Mark and I made a pact.You know, Mark and I were residents together and you know, we we had an agreement that we would pull each other up if we were using inappropriate terminology to describe a certain disease condition.
Or or fracture.Or so on.I think it's about getting into good habits.So what I would say is that make a pact with your work colleagues to say that we're not going to call them X-rays, they're radiographs.We're not going to, you know, talk about IPS, they're crania chordals.
And just tightening up the language that you use within the practice because then when you get into the exam process, it's second nature then to use the the correct terminology, it's a little bit unnatural because it, you know, ultimately doesn't often change what you do clinically.But remembering here, you're being examined and so you want to prepare yourself.
We recommend this for interns and residents.But also more specifically, there's a reason why those terms are used because they're specific and they're accurate.And so I think to some degree it will make you a better clinician too.It's not, they're not chosen to, to just try and make you sound smarter.
Often there's a reason why that term is used.So getting into good habits in your day-to-day clinical life I think is really good practice for preparation for the oral exams.And I think it also helps to actually not just study things, but actually have to like communicate them to other people, particularly when you start getting towards oral examination.
So it's one thing trying to say it over in your head, but actually having to say it out loud and and be able to crystallize your thoughts is was super useful.You literally need to practice by talking to someone else.I guess talking to your mate, that doesn't really mimic the stress that you're gonna feel, but at least you're practicing vocalizing things because sometimes you try and do it to yourself and you go, yeah, that's it.
That's that whole thing about cytokines or something.It's like, no, you need to actually say it.You need to actually verbalize it.So that's important to practice that.And you've had to deal with that or suggest dealing with that?That's really common.So you know, you might get a question and you'll be asked to come up with a list of diagnostic modalities to to investigate.
And you say, I'm going to do diagnostic modality A and then the next slide they'll turn around and say, well, we did diagnostic modality B and that's OK.Don't don't beat yourself up when that happens.You may still have got marks for choosing what you chose, but it may just not be what was actually performed in that one particular case.
And it doesn't mean that you're going to lose out marks for the rest of the that oral question, that oral scenario.So you can be wildly different to what the examiners did, but you can still pick up the rest of the marks going forward because, you know, what you've said in the first half doesn't actually change the marks you can pick up in the second part of that oral question.
So, yeah, it's very common that people say one thing, the examiners say another thing, and then they just breakdown because they think I've stuffed everything up.Just smile and nod and move on and answer the next question as best you can, Mark.I think that's great advice.It's like being in the moment and being present.
If you spend that oral exam pondering what you should have said 3 minutes ago or thinking about how you stuffed up that question 5 minutes ago, you won't be answering that question that is currently being asked as well as you could possibly do.So I think once you've answered it, you really move on to the next question.
Pay full attention to the question they're asking and much like the written, you answer the question that they've asked.Don't just go off on a tangent with what you want to talk about.You know, answer the question that they've asked.On that as well.And this doesn't affect your marks at all when you're doing the oral exam.
But I would say address the part.You know, I like to think of it similar to a job interview.You're kind of applying to be a, a member of this club.Yes, it's purely based on knowledge, but you also want to just give it the respect it deserves.So back when we used to do it in person, you wouldn't want to turn up in board shorts and jandals or thongs as you guys call them in Australia.
You wouldn't want to turn up in some daggy Ogg jumper, you know, with holes all through it.You want to just dress the part, dress appropriately, present a really professional image of yourself.Even if it's over Zoom.Just wear a shirt or something, you know, slightly more formal.You can wear whatever you want on the bottom half if they can't see it.
But just try and, you know, make an effort to look professional and say hey, I deserve to be a member of this club.Before you disappear, I wanted to tell you about our new weekly newsletter.
I speak to so many interesting people and learn so many new things while making the podcast, so I thought I'd go ahead.A little summary each week of the stuff that stood out for me.We call it the Vet Vault 321 and it consists of firstly 3 clinical pearls.These are three things that I've taken away from the clinical podcast episodes.
My light bulb moments, the penny dropping any new facts and the stuff that we need to know to make all the other pieces fit.Then two other things.This could be quotes, links, movies, books, a podcast, highlight anything that I've come across outside of clinical vetting that I think you might find interesting.
And then one thing to think about, I'll share something that I'm pondering, usually based on something that I've read or heard, but sometimes it'll be just my own musings or rants.The goal of this format is that you can spend just two to three minutes on the clinical stuff and move right along if that's all that you're after.But if you're looking for content that is more nourishing than cat videos or doom scrolling, then our two other things should send you in the right direction.
And then something extra for when you feel like a slightly longer read.If you'd like to get these in your inbox each week, then subscribe by following the newsletter link in the show description wherever you're listening to this.It's free.I think it's useful, it's fun, and it's easy to unsubscribe if it's not for you.
OK, we'll see you next time.