June 25, 2020

#31: Are you ready for practice ownership? With Dr. Zach Lederhose.

#31: Are you ready for practice ownership? With Dr. Zach Lederhose.
Apple Podcasts podcast player icon Spotify podcast player icon RSS Feed podcast player icon
Apple Podcasts podcast player icon Spotify podcast player icon RSS Feed podcast player icon
Season 1

In this episode of our business and leadership series with Dr. Shibly we speak to Dr. Zach Lederhose. Zach was about 2 years out of university and just 26 years old when he took the plunge into practice ownership. Ownership is a long term goal for many vets, but most of us feel that we need a certain level of age or expertise before we can even begin to consider it. But is that necessarily true? In our conversation we cover career progression, plateaus, pivots, and taking the road less travelled. Zac talks us through his decision making process leading to him buying the practice, and talks us through some of the challenges he’s faced. He gives advice on how to prepare yourself for a leadership role and how to prepare your new team for change. We talk about making ‘good’ mistakes, creating your ‘inner circle and how to put processes in place to guard against burnout. And if you’re already a business owner or a more seasoned vet - don’t be fooled by Zac’s age: this episode offers some sound business principles.

Testing, 1, 2 3 4, test test, test testing.Hubert is a penis brain test test test.So going to put that in there for I'm Gerardo Paulie.
I'm Hubert him strapped.And this is the vent valve, I guess for this episode of the business and Leadership series is doctors a clitoris.Zach was about two years out of University and only 26 years old.
So, about three or four years younger than I am.Now, when you decided to take the big plans into practice ownership now, practice ownership is a Long-term goal for many ways.But most of us feel that we need a certain level of age or expertise wisdom before.
We can even begin to consider taking that branch.Which is why when I heard about Zach, and his decision to jump straight in.So soon, after that school, I thought they had to get him here and cross-examine him on his decision making and the repercussions of the decision.We cover career progression, plateaus pivots and bucking, the career trajectory Trend.
Zach talks us through his decision-making process.Leading him to bind the practice and talks us through some of the challenges.He faced he gives advice on how to prepare yourself for a leadership role in, how to prepare your new team for change.We talked about good mistakes, creating Your Inner Circle, and how to put processes in place to guard against burnout.
And if you're already a business owner, or a more seasoned vet, don't be fooled by Zach.Sage, this episode offers some Sound business principles, so, it's well worth A listen.Hello, vit voltas and welcome back to another episode of the vent Vault and specifically, our business and Leadership series are very excited about tonight.
We are going to grill, somebody and get some good information out of our guests for the night.She really knows.I guess he's going to introduce him to us.Zach Lido's.Welcome to the podcast.Generally, tell us who he is.Welcome.Zach.I have the pleasure of introducing a really awesome dude.
Zach, some of you may have seen him Contributing massively on social media.Zach is a an up-and-coming youngster.I'm going to call you a youngster because you know, there's great as I am Zach, but you did a really Brave smart may be scary.
Stupid thing, let's find out what it was.But you decided at a fairly young stage in your career, to jump into Veterinary practice ownership and I believe you bought a practice out.So country rural Australia.
And an existing practice and you know, you've certainly given it a good run for its money.So great pleasure to have you on tonight Zach because it's certainly a rare breed.We don't see many young vets diving into practice ownership early on and we'd love to find out a bit more about your journey.
So can you tell us a little bit about how it all started?First of all, it's great to great to be on the podcast and and great to have Shibley, grilling me, it's nice, nice change.So, yeah, I guess I am a youngster, I'm 26 and graduated vet school at 23.
So haven't been long in the game but but a couple of years out, I had an opportunity to buy clinic in a country town and and then I've just been working on that for the last year and a half and has been doing doing really, really.
Well, it's a lot of fun and a lot of hard work.So I haven't decided whether it's crazy, stupid, or, or what else, yet?Yeah, so just give us a bit of a rundown Zach and what?One, congratulations have been on taking the plunge into business ownership.That is a big plunge.Like we're you really really drunk when you decided to not skiing but give us a bit of a rundown when like, where your practice is and like a zit small.
This as a mixed.Is it?Or yes.I'm in goulburn, which is a couple hours south of Sydney, an hour, north of Canberra.So we're not, we're not out in the sticks, but we're Regional Center and it's a small, his clinic.So, dogs cats, birds lizards, Yeah.
Anything that can come through the door, slams can come through the door.Apparently, like we've had lands in our emergency hospital.Not everyone's like, what do we do?It's so cute.We don't know what to do, but it's so cute.Yeah.So so moved to Goldman and, and yet settled in and it's just being been a constantly changing ride from from the start and every couple of months like the it's changing changing changing in its, it's a, it's a heap of fun.
Done it.So I'm curious you say that you had the opportunity was practice ownership on the cards for you.Like when you were going through med school when you when you qualified where you like I want to get into it as soon as possible or was it just how did it actually happen?
It was it was always in the 10-year plan.So going through vet school is always like that something that I'm going to do at some stage and I'm going to take take you know the chance when it comes but it wasn't supposed to happen this quickly.But but when you, when you get your ducks in a row and being a regional area, you know, when your partner has a job in the town and you and there's an opportunity and you can see yourself doing something, it's either I wait three years to take the opportunity in three years time or I take it now and and I thought, you know why not now?
Hmm.It kind of you can you go through your decision making process they're like, what are the things that you wait up?Or was I right?And that you were drunk and you didn't live very well, and Just did.I'm not saying things are very well right.But you know, like it was a split thing.And and then you're like, bam.Let's do it.Or was it kind of like you just said before you have a 10-year plan, right?
I don't know if maybe 10% of the people.I know maybe of a 10-year Plan B, that makes me think that it's pretty calculated decision.You know what kind of, you know, what kind of things are in your head.There was just obsessed about people making drug decisions because because he made a decision to do a podcast when he was drunk and now he's stuck with it again.
Thank you from writing a book now.Save your partner, two years later.He's still being punished, is he now, you're exactly right.Dorado was it was a calculated decision so it was getting to a point couple of years out.
What do you do next?You know, you've got to go to keep pushing and the traditional thing, when when I thought about it, going into vet school and through vesicle was, I'll go and lock him for a couple of years, and then I'll come back.And I might go into a specialty, you know, that, that classic thing that year, About all, we get itchy feet and you go to another clinic or you you do something else but but I was, I was quite, I guess spoiled it or not, that's not supported away.
But I was lucky that I kind of worked very hard and did a lot of on-call work and and kind of as a clinician develop my skills quite quickly.And so I reached a cap of what I could do as a general practice Journey, clinician and so The choice was do I go?
And specialized will do I do an internship or pursue that side of things and that area of growth or do I go and take on like a managing director type role in a corporate?Or do I go out on my own and, and they're going out on my own had had more Pros than cons, Mmm?
Yeah, like it's really, it's you say they're two years because that's the plateau, right?There's incredible growth and challenge the first 16 to 24 months, right?And then all of a sudden, you've seen Much stuff that maybe 90% of the things you see every day, pretty routine or and then the 10% a bit of a challenge enough, but then you go is this.
It is this the limits of my career within within the environment that I'm in?So then you go.Okay.So we change my environment or do I change our mentors and I was at a conference and I asked it was like a hundred students 100 100 new grads and I asked like how many people feel like as if they're going to like want to quit want to change the career like like how many people would reach this Plateau though?
Talking about math, 40% of them did and they were two years in, you say, yeah, with into, but some just graduated, some were two years and it was the hills recent grad, Retreat, Retreat, which is really good anyone who has ever Junior to go to one of those things should go.And it just highlighted to me that, that some people would you like Zach?
He did the brave thing, you decided, you know, the three options.Really, man.Most people things only three options, business ownership internship, change, career, or stay the same and And just this is my career and this is, you know, what I've got to do, somehow it's a courageous thing, it's a carriage thing for sure.
To make that.Levi, I know certainly when I was X8, I don't think I had the guts to make that jump, but because I had this impression that you need more experience more experience.So two years experience not enough, I need to see more clinically to before.I can take on those new challenges and I think I was wrong.
I actually saw a quote the other day and not regulated that I really like says that 10 years experience.Can sometimes be just one years experienced repeated ten times and I think that's what happens to people who hit that, Plateau, you go.Yeah, actually stick the same thing over.
I was actually there five years ago could have done it.I totally agree that you're wrong.There you have it.I agree that that you're like you're right about being wrong.It's the the years of clinical experience don't make you a better leader.
Yeah and make you better at business because vaccinating and spaying and And treating working out cases, doesn't make you develop the skills that make you a good, a good leader and part of a team like that, like it's a whole different skill set and you've got to start work on that skill set.
So how did you do that?Sorry I interrupted.I knew you're going to ask that.No, I gave Mike looking ask you two questions?You get to choose which one you want.Okay, okay.Okay.I just want my question just goes and leads on from the first question, which was was a calculated.
Question.But like what often people kind of like I don't want to do that because if I do that, these things could happen.So they have this kind of fears this this loss of version that I don't want to kind of like the like I don't want to lose this because they don't realize that you could do probably both at the same time so they don't want to do something good.
If you're like me a miss something or they feel like there's too many unknowns like but then the question I could ask himself is what information that I need to get for me to feel like as if the decision making process and I'm going through these more I calculated like so you said, they're your decision-making, process was calculated.
But what kind of information did you need for yourself?Was it like profit statements or something?Or was it was it like a number of clientele?Was it enough that you had experience and feel like I don't know what was your decision?What was it?What are the things that contributed to your decision to buy a part from the plateau?
Yes, so I needed to know that I could feed myself.That was a part of it.So I needed to know that I was actually I would to build the procedures and do the work and I had the clinical competence to actually be able to do run a clinic, you know, and that comes from working sole charge and you know, mentoring other vets and things like that.
But that the other thing that came into it was was just getting a little bit of perspective on.Yes, it's a big scary but not the end of the world, you know.Like if if I failed and had to sell a business I go and work, you know, go over a few years.
Then it would all be or be distant memory and, you know, in 5-10 years.But but it's about, you know, not not making a bigger problem than what it is and a bigger challenge, you know, break it down.Yeah, you know, it's really interesting.I'm just going to jump in there.
I love that sort of thought process in making a decision because I do see a little bit time through coaching and especially through helping new graduates with newer graduates with making decisions, they sort of feel like it's all Nothing and you know, if I go down this pathway, the consequences of failures, so massive that I'm too scared to go for it with sounds to me.
Like, you had a plan B, you had a safety net, you had a fullback going.Hey, I'm going to do this thing and you winning all well, but you had this sort of safety, net that.Hey, if it all goes belly-up, I can still go back to working.Like I'm young.I can start again, big deal.
That's one of my favorite things about that is that Satan?It people have a people winter about via that it doesn't pay well in that.The reality is you always have that safety, net.You can try whatever.They only one.If you run out of money, put up your hand, you'll have a job within a couple of weeks and boom, you're feeding yourself.
So it's really lovely to know that.But also I think comes to as well that Zach has there is a lot of courage and confidence.You said it was courageous for Hubert, but confidence in the fact that if it And work out, you know, like he knows he's got the, I don't know.
This is, this is me thinking like, hey, I'm the exact, right?I guess.But it's like it's much better looking.But it was like, okay, what I'm saying is what I seen you.Zach is the fact that actually you had the confidence to go.Look, I'm gonna give this a go.
I know that I can go that everyone has that safety net.So it's not necessarily Satan.It's a fact that actually showed confidence in yourself and you back this off, to go look.Even if doesn't fail, I can work it out wherever I'm at.I can work it out.That's what I kind of see in you as opposed to just the safety net of I have my career still and I'm young.
Yeah, it's not it's something that's not comfortable for sure.I mean, no one wants to wants to experience failing.But tell you what, I'd rather rather foul with taking over.What was a war vet clinic?You know, and trying something rather than saving up for another five years until as a better vet in inverted commas before taking on a bigger project and failing at that one, you know?
So it's It's kind of fell small, rather than go all in later on.Mmm-hmm, is that gun curious about the lead-up to this?I know we spoke about that sort of two-year Plateau, but we food with a lot of people who get into business that business Journey doesn't start when they're in their 20s or 30s.
It started like really really young, you know, and it might be influence from their parents or watching certain things in their life which is impacted them and they kind of made a decision going.I'm never doing this.I'm definitely doing that.You know, what was the journey for you because ultimately, you know, two years at most vets are not thinking of the thinking, how can I LeapFrog into getting more experience doing the internship changing direction pivoting?
But generally, that if it doesn't involve jumping into my own practice.So, when did that Journey?That the sort of Entrepreneurship Journey stamp for you?What was that influence?Well, yes, the it's about for me whenever I come across that.
On a concept.It's all that modeling and if you can see people like you doing that thing, you know, and so so growing up.I didn't have paid for that.Like, a family is not entrepreneurial, but when I got to vet school, I took the opportunity to get involved in a VA and go to as many conferences as possible as a student.
And at these conferences, I'd meet people from all walks of that life.So you know I hang out with the equine vet side, hang out with the Exotic fat side.Hang out with With basically anybody who would buy me a drink at the puppet after the dinner.But but what it showed me was a huge range of of different beds and so I got to start thinking about, you know, the challenges that are affecting vets not so much the challenges that are affecting students because this is like second third year.
You know you think about the next exam you're thinking about the next next track that you've got to get ready for And so when I got to speak to these people, I kind of got found myself more interested in there, you know, business streams and the practice management and and looking at those kinds of things as being really interesting.
In addition to the clinical things, rather than trying to find out, you know, the latest way to treat a Connie loss or, or something like that, which is all important.But but I was gravitating towards that from, you know, halfway through vets.That's cool.That's great.I like your of your approach though that some, it's an unusual approach.
I think it's a I think it's a great approach is to from early on in your career, to keep your, keep your mind open to go beyond just because we all get so focused on clinical clinical clinical, it's excellent that you had the foresight to do that.So you mentioned leadership earlier, that, that is a challenge.
That's a fun challenge.But it is a challenge.How big is your team Jack?We've got a paper now and the time that sort of activist main main a nurse, and now we are a people.So we've Got to vets now and, and for nurses.
Sorry and a trainee.So that's eight.Yeah.Well, so how are you learning about leadership?Is the official resources that you went to, or you just learning on the Fly?What are you doing to get good at this?Yeah, well I was at my first job, we did some stuff on leadership.
So that was a big focus of my my first boss to to make sure that we had that kind of vocabulary and we were sharing but you know, There's so many resources out there and so many things that you can look at, you know, you can go to the conference's, you can you can talk to people but a lot of it is just looking at the information is out there and saying, hey people are putting out some really good stuff, you know and you see enough of it and you say okay these are the things that actually speak true and there's the people who are walking the walk and learning from them, you know?
Hey I've gone to conferences and paid for paid for things but there's also so many books and podcasts and everything that you can.Check out you were saying before just then my impression maybe a.Hopefully I'd listened and heard everything, but but your journey from from graduation to.
Now, my assumption was that you actually, this is your first job.So did you work in a sound?Like, as if you worked in a practice where your boss then valued leadership, and training and things?Then that's where it kind of.
Like, I don't know.It helps solidify something in your mind, right?But then, the opportunity came arise but not necessarily because you would that was your job out of graduation.But you saw the actually the opportunity was there like so what you went to a practice, then you moved from that practice into this practice and then you bought it or how was it with a how that go?
Yes, I started an impact a snobby that's down in Kuma and, and I was there for four coming up on on two years I think and saw this practice in a completely different In town, completely different, part of part of New South Wales and and saw that one was for sale and it was basically a six-week changeover between the old old owner and me well the whole new whole new place that's kind of cool.
So what did what like what was what were the challenges you face?Like I don't know.We could I don't know like if you could think about the first couple things that you really have to tackle, like what were the things you kind of have to tackle there?The changes changes heart and for a lot of people.
And so, the Big Challenge was people have been used to saying the previous owner there for 30 years.You know, there's over 30 years and then there's this, this young fellow who's coming in, you know, most of the preparation idea.
Was made sure that I grew up.I stubble so that the people didn't think I was 12.So you say, yeah, it was, it was managing the client expectations and they keep Part of that, for me was keeping keeping the the nurse that I had on, she'd been there for quite a while before hand.
And and managing that transition was super important.That was the, that was the biggest challenge.And then the the training, the clients on what to expect.And the new way we do things and things like that was less of a, less of a challenge.
I mean, a lot of people, I hear that talked about a lot as one of the challenges when you take over a clinic, but we're all singing from the same Shop song sheet and most people The dog to the vet once a year.You know, it's 20 minutes if you can give you can, you know, control that experience to give them a really good experience and just be really gentle with it and not be like, oh, everything was wrong for the last 15 years and no, this is the new way we're doing things.
It's just taking people on that journey and realizing that people aren't going to take that step so quickly firm, you know, all across the board.Like, I love, I love the approach is sort of softly gently.And then and then slowly winning people over.
Now they talk about buying a clinic and generally in the first two in the first year you will drop about 20% in Revenue because a lot of that Goodwill that was tied up with the old guy who everybody loved the new for the last 40 years.
He's now moved on.And did you experience a drop then?What did you do to sort of counteract that Yes, sir for us a little, what we did was in terms of the actual Revenue side of things was getting our systems, right?
So, I took over a clinic that had been pedaling along for a while, but, you know, if you're looking for a clinic to take over, you want to look at systems that you can optimize, you know, getting your vaccinations in mind as getting your client communication, right?Right from the start, that's going to increase your Revenue quite significantly because you're going to have a people actually coming in every year, you know, you Do you increase that increase your opportunities and so that, that alone makes a big difference, and then it was just just business as usual, you know, making sure that we were doing those same things.
Looking after the clients following through, you know, being a good place to go.You said before, and maybe you came back to the leadership training that you did in your previous practice.But whenever you step into a new team right provided that, you know, the team was See to write actually.
And then one, right?But the you you saw and like the smart thing you did.Was it you saw that your link to your clients, right?The clientele was.This one staff member?So I'm assuming this staff member was kind of like the, you know this the you know, the person next to the vet, right?
New kind of like so they that put your vet went.So therefore this person now was their connection with the whole practice and so forth.But how did you and like they talk about?About the act of deference where you defer to that person in a way, right?
You can't just go.Okay, Sally.Now that Bob's gone.Now we're going to do is we're going to my way, right?Okay.But how do we, what was that process of of?I don't know winning Sally over or or because she had to endorse you essentially in the end, right?
She answered the phone and she'd have to endorse you.How did you get her to accept change?And endorse you.And, and yeah.Yeah.So her name is Danny.She's a superstar, but we took it really slowly.So I met her when I was thinking about buying the clinic, you know, we met up a few times before we actually started working together and it was it was conversations around values, a lot of it and there are some values that were right on and and she admitted she was like I'm not comfortable with change.
So I finally, you know, I've been We kind of agreed on the things that we could change and things are really important for me to change and some things that we thought look, that would be nice but we don't need to change it right away.So that was just things like phone systems and computer systems and things like that, that that were that comfort and the way that we do things, but it meant that by having that give and take, we could really, you know, make the changes that were important moving forward.
And then, you know, a few months later I was like, oh, maybe we can change that, you know, maybe we can, we can do this or maybe we, Try that thing that you were talking about a few months ago.So the important things were super important, you know, patient care, standards of care, you know, different drugs, things like that, the, that were non-negotiables, but, but you've got to be flexible because it's, it's one of those challenges that especially if you want them to sound board and you want them to endorse you.
Because when Mary Jane comes in with a three cats, you want them to be like, oh my God, they're so good with your with cats.You're going to love them, you know, and so so making sure that that endorsement was sincere.Was super important for me.Yeah, wasn't like, hey Danny, there's no other Vet Clinic around here.
If you want to stay in the town, you guys know.Just this is it.That's beautiful dude.Like, I love what you say, man.It's awesome, what I, what I'm taking from this is, I certainly felt for a very long time that I'm not that I couldn't possibly be equipped to be. good leader or to run a practice, it's a confidence thing and that you have to have some Personality trait of super skill or super power to be able to do it and maybe it takes 10 years to get there and Zach's just showing now yet doesn't and if you don't, you can just learn it.
You just go and find the resources and learn it because the stuff you talk about is you see that in every good leadership book, any management book and you're obviously just taking it in the buying it and and it seems like it's working.Fantastic.Hello.Can I jump in with something?One of the quotes that I love?
And there was a an old guy.I think he's Ladies it's now gone.His name is Charlie, tremendous Jones.It was one of the first of motivational speakers on the circuits and one of the things he said is you'll be the same person five years from now, as you are today except for the books that you read in the people that you meet.
And, you know, that doesn't really stuck with me early on in my journey and answer around in that you know, who are you surrounding yourself with?Who influences you and sometimes we don't have that now.Network directly around us where you can't necessarily tap into those mentors.
So, you have to sort of find virtual Mentos in the way of books and back, then it was CDs or audio tapes and they'll maybe podcasts, you know, such as this or someone and things are good that you listen to, to help influence your mindset.
What was it for you there?What was the the books that you read, other people that you met other conferences that you chose to surround yourself?Self with because from what I know of you, you've done a lot of you've surrounded yourself, a lot with clinical learning like you said, you did a lot of ADA stuff and you've done a lot of stuff in education, you know.
A lot of that is clinical, rather than business management leadership sort of skill.So where did that stuff come from?There's so much stuff that that you do.And that I've done it just Builds on itself, you know, year after year.
I mean, starting at those conferences that that I sat in as a student but also courses, that I was put through as an employer.You know, I did did Lincoln, you know, emerging leaders at hit that x with Dave nickel and, and then had conferences, you know, trying to get, get your bum on the seat in as many, you know, really good presentations as possible and And trying to get to, as many courses as you can, you know, whether that's sacrificing clinical learning to go to these causes and, and even starting the practice, you know, which shut down for a few days.
When it was a very small team and can go to a conference all together and though, you know, we just thought, you know, miss out on a day or two of of a few consoles because it was only a few console today at that time and and take the time to actually go away and focus on that.
Absolutely, it's a positive change that.I don't know if it's actually a change in the conference structure or just a change in the stuff I'm interested in but I am very happy to see that when you go to these conferences there's a much there seems to be a much heavier Trend towards developing yourself, developing a team rather than just the clinical stuff.
And it's very, very tempting, especially as the young red to just want to go, listen to all the newest hottest clinical tips, but you don't actually do yourself any favors, there's Much value.Like I think a lot I noticed it the conference is a lot of young of it focused very heavily on the clinical staff, which is understandable but those other stuff, the performance skills, they digest for the practice owners and for the old farts, there's a lot of value.
I've enjoyed some of those sessions in means, they just communication skills that everything like that.At that helps you so much.And that's the thing you can go to clinical stream about a weed type of I tumor and that's going to have a really big impact on the one patient that you see that has that been eating absolutely.
Or you can go to a session or you can go to a course, that's about communication and how you interact as a team and how you communicate things to clients.And that's going to impact every single time, every day to work and everything.Paige.Can you say hi and beyond that?Even that that's the other thing.
You said in those, Moses and you learn about communicating in that and you think you're learning for work.And then next time you have an argument, you'll see a wife, you go, hang on a minute.It's a better way of doing this.So did say it extends so far beyond, just just your working life, right?So, I definitely one of the best investment you can make is investing in yourself as a leader and, and even just don't even as a leader just as a part of a team, you know, the senior time in those things, I mean, there's free books as free podcast, there's so much stuff out there and you can, you can find the information if you want to.
And even if you can't get away to a conference or you can't afford that you can get started.It's hard to look back and think where different parts come from, you know, you, you read so many things and you listen to so many things and everything like that.I guess, the, you know, a lot of podcasts stuck out.
What, what I find really interesting in in the podcasting and what got me onto like, listening to lots of leadership stuff and reading lots of leadership stuff was, was a lot.Behavioral economics and things about like how we actually think about the world, which was really interesting from a Consulting side of side of thing.
Like when you're in the consult room, how do your words influence, what people do?And the way that you say them and then that's transferable to your interpersonal relationships and and, and all through there.So, so, you know, there's there's a moon moon podcasts out there, you know, Freakonomics things like that.
But then in the, in the vet space, I mean got to give a lot of credit to Dave nickel for his Coming.The, the guests and saying, the modeling people on there from from all parts of the world.Doing cool things in business and, and in the vet world is great.
And then then, you know, there's so many so many books out there.But, you know, thinking fast and slow is a great, great one about how we make decisions.And, and just thinking about those things may be more interested in in how how to work in a team.
And how the how to work with clients and so that kind of sparked the leadership leadership interest, It's a great time, it's a great time for information.I think it every time I listen to a good podcast, I just go man what a plan.
Absolute privilege here.I am just driving home from work.Having literally feels like you have two of the smartest people in the world driving along with.You just having a chat and you can just it is just like sitting at a dinner party and just eavesdropping and it just absorb all of that knowledge.
It's really is incredible.Time.I'll ever stack to you.Do you guys do on cool?I yes yeah we do.So we've been through a bit of a journey with on call and I can kind of kind of see where the questions going so I'll let you know.No I'm just kidding.
So how do you because you did you say that you've got?Another vet, does it either made the only bit?Yeah so we've got we've got part-time like that's who for reasons or another on calls.Not not something that's feasible for them at the at the load that would you know split it, you know, equally between In between 3.
And that's fine.So, fortunately we've I've put a lot of effort into trying to making make good relationships with the other clinics around.Initially, I was doing it, you know, all myself, I did that for about three or four months because I thought this is is what you got to do.
You know, you're new to the town, you've got to got to be there.Then I realize there's is, you know, six clinics within a certain radius.They're all doing uncle, it's crazy.So I tried try to, you know, a few times over the last 12 months to try to get a shared system in and manage to have a clinic that helps me out with weekends and I do during the week.
And now we're just about to start a shared rotor between a few of the Clinic's.Excellent.Yeah, you've got some may question.The question was, how do you, how do you take care of yourself because it is a landed yourself in a high responsibility position.It's not a You can't just pluck off at the end of the day and go.
Well, now, I don't care what happens to the place.That's it is.Well, to me the biggest challenge of practice ownership is that constant?It's a, it's a ball and chain, sometimes you can't get rid of it.And how do you manage to get yourself out of that head space, and into space.
We actually have some proper time off and obviously, much much, much harder when you actually 24/7 365.Yeah, it's impossible and and you've got To you know, just either if you can't do it, just don't do out of hours.
You know.You've got to got a responsibility to patients but you've also got more responsibility to your future patients you know.So you want to burn yourself out and so getting to a position where we can share and it's it's building up that trust with other clinics.And you know, when I was new to town, I'm sure it was like, who is this new person?
What are they doing?You know, what are they going to do?They're going to do, but working in a cooperative and collaborative approach, really?Is going to pay dividends for all of us.It's really interesting approach, because a lot of a lot of people in business, see themselves, as a bit of an island and you're competing, and business, can be very lonely.
And I'm curious about that whole starting bit for you as well.Because I know a lot of vets who have gotten into practice because they hated the way their boss did things and they had this kind of attitude, like, right, I need my own Clinic, I've got to do things my way and that's why I'm going into business. - and then, you know, with that kind of goes all the other isolation that comes with it.
And obviously it seems like you have a very different approach and that wasn't your journey.What were your mean, like, what was your motivation for doing?It was, it was it?I don't like this practice.I don't like the way things are being done.I've got to do standards my way.Or was it more financial?I can't lie.Financial is a factor and anybody that goes into business, financial decisions have to be part of it because you're investing your money, you know, you Invest your money in other things and make it not Financial apart from drivers.
Audi, there's a financial of heart obviously.But the for me, the the I guess that one of the motivations like as I was pushing myself, but but wanting to be able to have a broader influence than just my patients and my little island of Consulting, you know, if you want to want to influence, Once more people, you need a bigger team and you need a bigger platform.
And, and so, you know, in the consult room, we've got this great opportunity to influence the pet owner in front of us.But but then, you can take that and if you know, if I can grow my team and then I can influence the pet care of all of these, all of these pets and and also influence the working hours and the environment and the kind of team environment that the vet Team Works in because there's a, there's a lot of people one, I'm happy and in our profession and it Seems like if you got an opportunity to positively influence that, then then you should, I love it.
So it seems like a much stronger stronger drive for you is, you know, contribution and being able to empower and give back without beef.It's a massive massive contribution.And, and that's, you know, I'm sure sure you all do, and I do a lot of time volunteering for different different groups and things like that.
And mentoring mentoring, young vets.And it's, you don't make money out of it, but it's, it's important.Okay.So what's your, what's your vision for the click for your business?What's your what's your goal with the road?You helping out what you've said some of the things you want to achieve but specifically for your business.
Where is it going?So I want to grow it to probably double the size of this.Now, at least in in the town, we are.It's, you know, you're limited by population instance.Whereas you aren't so limited in say, the cities or or things like that, but I want to go out to a point where it's a business that I can take a step back from and not not be on the tools all the time.
Being such a small Clinic being.So new there is that, you know, you've got to go to keep working as a vet and so Getting it to that next stage, where then we can.Okay, let's take a step back.Take more mentoring role is going to be really exciting and then and then it's looking at, you know, do you grow the current opportunity or we do look for, for more opportunities elsewhere, but, but getting, getting something that can have a life of its own, as is pretty exciting.
So that's kind of the next goal.Hey Zach.It sounds like, as if you made a lot of right decisions are not saying you haven't made in wrong decisions, but sometimes it's hard to reflect and actually realize some of the challenges that you faced and maybe the wrong decisions, you made there any wrong decisions that you made was a wrong.
Okay but decisions you made that upon reflection were like oh that was not a good call but yeah like buying a fraction of a second.There's a reason there's a reason I was confident that I could do We running a clinic on my own, and that was because I've made a lot of mistakes as a clinician not, not the clinical errors, but errors in will definitely, definitely those.
I'm sure.But, but errors in client, communication errors in how to challenge, you know, approach problems with the team so many mistakes.There's one time where I had a part of a puppy in isolation and didn't latch the cage, and the next morning, the whole Clinic was covered in.
Anybody who thinks that they can manage worse than that.I have made, is that made it worse decision where the power gets its.
So, so how it's the same year?But we had one of their clinical rotations Do what's called out basins where you literally just Consulting with, and then the students had to do the overnight.So, but in patient, patient care.
And then we had this little flattered that you can go have sleep and it was pretty quiet and it was Easter long weekend as well.So that's probably feeling very sorry for myself.A real only that I was there.I was there all night by myself and there was this, gorgeous little dashwood puppy in the Bible award.It's a never go.
We had tons of power in the area that we were in was not the best socioeconomic areas.Tons of times.This is one pop there wasn't all that sick but just very sad, very sorry for itself or I was feeling very sorry for myself so I took it to the flat and put it in bed with me and it shared had diarrhea little bit.
Dogs can get out of isolation into your bed.I'm just curious.Did they lock you in the isolation of early next week after dinner?But in terms of either from what you've seen because I'd read it terms of starting your practice.
It sounds like you.Are doing things pretty right, mistakes that you've made or that you.You've seen other people make or even even people who don't buy practices, are people making wrong decisions.We that you could go that I you can think differently about that.
Yeah, there's a couple things so I make mistakes still often.I mean, I'm like I said, I'm a spring chicken but, but I made a mistake, you know, two weeks ago we I had a weird transition to a new, it system and, you know, we had had a new event starting and then everything just broke with the computers.
We looked like we were going to lose, like, months and months of data.No, no timeline on when it was happening, it's just an absolute disaster and I was stressed out for like, 48 Hours like two lines.And, and when I was stressed out and in that situation, I wasn't controlling my my emotions and my communications, as well as I should, as well as I normally do and that then passed onto the team, you know, and that was a big mistake, you know, and that mistake has has impacts but But then you can go back and you can say I look I stuffed up, you know, I like and and I've had that discussion with with the team and said look this was, you know, not the right way to handle it and then we going to move forward, you know.
And that was like two weeks ago, you know, like it's gonna as mistakes that are going to keep happening, no matter what situation you're in and you're going to keep making them.They often talk about you in a circle and I'm fortunate that I have these Two Fellas.
I mean, a circle as well as my partner and your the business partners and AES and I don't regret a coach and things as well.I need several people to keep me in line but I don't know like I don't know how, I don't know what, what's your inner circle, like kind of who keeps you grounded or who kind of keeps you on track and but also who keeps you like looking big and having big.
Asians you know, so is it easy self-driven or is it actually you picked the right people?Yeah I I've got plenty of people to keep me grounded.Yeah.It's a very flat you know management pyramid so to speak in that form.
They like to remind my failings but yeah, I guess the having having a life partner my girlfriend who who keeps me?Brutally honest.You know, if I say, I'm going to go to that next week and she's like, did you did you really, you know, and just having people that remind you, you know, that you're not the vet, you're not the boss, you're not not that person.
Your natural person is so important and it's not just important for leaders.It's awesome.But of all of us as practicing that we spend eight hours of every day, being the person in the room, that knows the most that guides the decisions and has so much influence over these over.These clients of ours but that's not who we are, you know, and you'll remember that.
That's it's healthy to have people bring you down and also have people bring you back up again.Hmm.Do you believe it's because they understand where you want, and what you want, where you want to lead the practice.And so you've shared your vision, you shared your vision effectively in a way that they know, they know when you're an out of alignment.
So they can bring you back in alignment or they know that exacts the guy that's going to lead us there and he needs us now to slap him in the face and go.Hey dude, you can do this like is it like that's my take would, but my thought would be is it around vision and uncommon.Standing in alignment between the team would, how did you achieve that?
So, I think it's, there's the vision that you can sit down and write down and write your goals up on a white board.And say, this is what we believe.But then there's also what you do every day and how you how you interact.So whenever we've got a challenge, you know, as long as the person is comfortable sharing it will sometimes use that to help other people.
So I had a nurse nurse the other day.I'm struggling with with drug dogs calculations.And I was like, look, there's no.Say over here sucked.At three months ago.You know what I got?And I was like, hey, remember when like, when that was a really big challenge just like, yeah, used to be a problem.This is how I dealt with it.
So it's this kind of trying to make it a safe space to stuff up and doing it in small ways.And I'm like okay this is this is really crap.So that when we are when we do have a big error and you guys run big busy emergency or suppose there's times when there's this stuff ups and you know, you've got to be able to say okay that happened.
Let's move on, let's deal with it and then then go back.And know that it wasn't me today but it could be me next time and how I support that person or how I interact with that person at that time.That's going to be how I get treated next time.So you role model the way of like a culture of learning and just acceptance and and it was that something that you picked and chose or was that just the something that your first initial boss role model that way as well.
I think it's something that I consciously chose this idea of failing small and failing often and that's from Atul.Gawande is a is a writer and surgeon and write for the New York Times and he writes a lot about complications and how you actually deal with medical errors The best way to deal with them is to own up to them and say look, this is is what happened?
Let's assess it.Let's figure out a plan and let's move forward but you can apply that not just domestically as you can apply that to everything.You know, you like to communication areas and and and failings all over the place.Until then goes one day.Atul, and then the surname is going to ga Gradebook complications.
You going to check it out.Yeah, nice thing.That's really think that there was some attended a seminar once and there were a whole lot of high-profile young entrepreneurs up on stage.It wasn't within the veterinary.Space is just general business and they would guys your age and younger who had created multi-million dollar businesses and sort of built it, sold it moved on to the second one.
Like these guys were just killing it at a very young age.It would seem and what was interesting is they had these young, you know, 2020 in the Mid-20s people up on stage and they asked him, what advice would you give yourself as an 18 year old?And the astounding, the resonating advice that came out was fail, faster.
It was this concept of do it fast, fail faster.Therefore you will learn faster, you'll grow faster.And and I just want to talk about this just for a minute within the veterinary space because, you know, we are risk averse.We don't like to take risks with our patients, we beat ourselves up when we lose a patient, make a clinical mistake.
Make a judgment error at does error anything, you know, upset a client lose a client, even have a rejection in the consult room.When we suggest something and they say no we find that like a personal sort of failure and we take that to heart.How do you see, how do you feel we as an industry and I'd love to hear your take on and have you feel we need to start to approach failure as an industry.
It's that's huge.That's something that There's systemic things.All through the people that we select for vet school.There's things all throughout uni.But then there's also what we can control in the workplace.And with the clients, you know, we've, we've got to fail small and be prepared to look at what we've done and then learn enough about it that it doesn't happen that exact way again.
So let's say, we're doing a spay and we drop a ligature to someone sit down to someone, say, I'll get out of the way.That was your crappy surgeon.I'm going to jump in there.I'm going to fix it.You're not doing surgery for a month, which is a literal, real example, that I know has happened to appear.
If one or do we say, you know what?I'm just going to stand here, make your incision bigger.Let's go in, let's take it, systematically, and then afterwards Not In the Heat of the Moment.Not when you're in this fight/flight response, sit back and say, okay, what could we have done differently to do that better next time.
How do we look at that?And what can we do?And what are you going to do?Do moving forward and then teaching people to come up with their own Solutions.So that becomes an internal debrief or an internal thing that you go through and then you can even do it before the procedure, you know, before what he's coming in for a surgery, you know, you got okay.
What happens if I drop the ligature, not catastrophizing, but thinking, okay, there's a system here.You know, I can solve this and if you just build up small things, big things, big things and before long, you you making crazy decisions like, like, starting a practice or taking a leadership.
On the team or you're trying that neck surgery, that that has scared the bejesus out of me.The failure thing in our in our profession I think we set up for it you don't you don't get into vet school through failing a lot.You got to do well at school and then the mostly High Achievers in other fields as well.
So I think we just start just have any practice at failing.So Wednesday with to the real world with failure is right on your doorstep but we just don't handle it well so I don't know how to change it.We did you I suppose it basically fell quite a bit certainly most of us My take on that is actually it comes from the role model, right?
They comes from the person, you look up to the person who's trained you.If there's no tolerance for failure, you'd be terrified of failure.Therefore, you would always strive for Perfection, you wouldn't take action because you're too scared of taking action, unless it's perfect, right?You got to push it out to the world to get feedback to see whether it works, right?
But if your role model, then accepts the fact that an in chairs the fact that That what they learned was through, small failures and failing safe.As you said before, then it creates the culture of I'm going to try this but I know that you know that Zach's in the Next Room and I run through the plan with him.
I'm gonna give this a go because I can fail safe and it's okay if I don't get it, right.So I think, I think role modeling the way is a key component of what I believe, Zach, it sounds like as if you've done.And so many aspects of leadership that you just kind of say you had, I doubt it's random.
It's not raining, right?You wouldn't be going through this process and getting to this point by random chance, right?You're taking deliberate actions of that the way you want to interact, right?The way that you decided to transition to the practice, the way that you decided that you had the gray zone, is the great dangers of blacks and whites, when when we, when I come through, this is the level of menu, like there was calculated Decisions all the way through, including the way that you act and behave, and congratulations, man.
You on your 2627 like now, I'm only like 28.Right?So, you know, we're almost the same and that's key but like it's incredible actually listening to you.We've got, we better wrap up by saying my takeaways from from this, from listening to Zack.
Well, other than that, I clearly was way behind Zach when I was expecting Arabia, Iran is no age limit on, on being able to do this if you're in the right place at the I know I put Sydney but his knee and I know a lot of it just felt now, I'm too young.
That's too much of a commitment.I don't think I've tried it yet.You can do it.But then I think What You've Done Right is you sitting a dried?You setting it up, right?From the, from the beginning, by getting your values as a token to your stuff about values, knowing exactly where you are, taking the practice and being clear about that.
And then this, the other thing that I and I is, same thing is Gerardo I can hear it in what you say, you clearly investing in yourself as a leader.And as a person, you see so many practice owners who start the practice and they so overwhelmed by the the day-to-day Administration.
And and the clinical cases are so varied and all the clinical stuff that they just never ever take anything.To to work on themselves and it shows it shows and now there's practices around and it's I've worked for plenty of them and I'm guilty of it myself, but I think just investing in yourself from the beginning and saying this is, I'm going to grow and become a better leader, become better at everything.
I'm not the complete picture.I'm open to learning.I think that is going to be okay to kicking this for this one out the park.It's going to be great.I think.Mmm.I I know a lot of younger vets, at your level.They're still grappling with the basics, like they thinking.
Do I still want to be a vet or not?You know, how can I, and they end up sort of reaching a plateau, where they start to they stop growing and they start to refer everything, they kind of reach the limit and they go.This is as far as I can get to clinically as far as leadership goes with growth etcetera and like home.
This is it a maxing out here and I'm going to refer everything else or defer everything to somebody else.How have your peers responded to you and how have you had to change?Have you had to make new friends to allow you to still grow forward?
Have you had to swap up?If you know what I mean?No, I think that my friends are the ones that, like, I say, keep me grounded, but, but we're all growing in different directions.You know, there's people doing going into, residencies, this people taking on leadership roles as people who are starting family.
So we've got everyone's going off And these different directions.And that's I think that's the role of friends in that in that space is to a keep you grounded, and keep you honest.But also it's all about that diversity in in your family and in your community.
You know, you want to want to have people to challenge you in lots of different ways.Look, I really appreciate the times.I thanks for putting your hand up and being willing to talk to us.Have a lovely recovery, buddy.If we catch you next time.Thank you so much.Thank you for listening.
Remember to go check out the show notes at Vivid bob.com for summary of, some of the best bits from the episodes and our guests favorite resources.If you found value in this and you can think of a friend or colleague who could benefit from the content, then please do them a favor and share this episode with them.

Dr. Zach Lederhose