Jan. 9, 2020

#21: Resilience is not a personality trait, with coach Carolyne Crowe.

#21: Resilience is not a personality trait, with coach Carolyne Crowe.
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Season 1

Carolyne Crowe worked for 11 years as an equine vet both in the UK and in New Zealand before deciding to shift her energy from primarily helping animals to helping people by becoming  an award winning personal performance coach, mentor, international speaker, researcher and lecturer.She has a Master's degree in Workplace Health and Wellbeing and continues to research this field. She is a master trainer in DISC behavioural profiling, a CPCAB trainer in Stress management and Wellbeing, a certified trainer in Resilience, a Mental Health First Aider, and an Honorary Lecturer of the University of Liverpool. She was awarded “Life Coach of the year 2015” at the International Coaching Awards, became an honorary Fellow of The Coaching Academy in 2016 and a founding member of the Coaching of Excellence accreditation in 2019.  So basically - when it comes to building a fulfilled career in veterinary science, or anywhere for that matter - you'll want to hear what Carolyne has to say.Carolyne is passionate about helping others equip themselves with the tools and strategies to get the most out of their personal and professional lives. After successfully running her coaching and training business for several years, Carolyne now works as a training consultant with the Veterinary Defence Society training team in the UK developing, training and coaching individuals, teams and practices to be the best they can be and to thrive both personally and professionally. In 2017 she proved  how much she loves a challenge by running 10 marathons in 10 days raising over £100,000 for the Brooke charity. Not bad for someone who only ran her first marathon in September 2016! Outside of work Carolyne is a wife of a vet, mother of 2 small children and what she describes as “a keen runner’. We cover a wide range of topics in our conversation with Carolyne, like some the most common problems that she encounters with her clients and her favourite solutions to these problems, building resilience and self- awareness, why coaching is important and who it’s for, and of course: how to prepare for running 10 marathons in 10 days when you have a business to run and two young kids, and, more importantly, why you’d want to do it in the first place.  Carolyne also answers a tricky listener question about a situation that many of our listeners will have to deal with at some point in their careers. To see the show notes or to check out our guests’ favourite books, podcasts and everything else we talk about in the show, click the webpage link on the episode page wherever you listen to us, or visit the podcast website at https://minivetguide.com/podcast/. If you have a question that you’d like us to answer with the help of our guests you can leave us a voice message by going to our episode page on the anchor app (https://anchor.fm) and hitting the record button, via email at thevetvaultpodcast@gmail.com, or just catch up with us on Instagram. (https://www.instagram.com/thevetvault/) We’d love to hear from you! And if you like what you heard, then please help us to spread the word by subscribing to the podcast (it’s free!), and by telling your friends about us. More about Carolyne: https://www.carolynecrowe.co.uk https://www.vds-training.co.uk Carolyne’s ten marathons in ten days challenge: http://www.ten2london.co.uk Carolyne’s favourite podcast: Beast of Man  https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/kevin-pietersen-beast-of-man/id1462286114 Book recommendations  ‘Start With Why’,  Simon Sinek:  https://simonsinek.com/product/start-with-why/ ‘Mindset’, Carol Dweck https://www.amazon.com/Mindset-Psychology-Carol-S-Dweck/dp/0345472322 ‘Black Box Thinking’, ‘Bounce’, and others, Matthew Syed: https://www.matthewsyed.co.uk ‘Drive’, Daniel Pinkhttps://www.danpink.com/drive./

Okay, I'm good to go and you up, okay.Mmm.Oh I said I put chitchat in there.I thought we should I don't know did we talk to each other or?Oh, that's funny.I was actually going to say just to check run baking dish. one of the best bits of advice I've ever received was to find good mentors and to learn from them trusted people who have already done what you're trying to do now I've been fortunate throughout my career to have some fantastic mentors to help guide me but I realize that they'd be hard to find and also hard to commit the time to 1 this is why we've gathered some of the best Minds from the vet new world and squeeze them for their wisdom so that you don't have to learn the hard way with the help of our guests we flipped the veterinary profession on its back Can explore its soft underbelly to find the tips tools and inspiration that you'll need to build the career that you've always wanted.
I'm Gerardo Poli.I'm Hubert him strapped and this is the vent valve.Welcome back to the vet Vault after our little Christmas break.
I hope you all had a Merry Christmas and an amazing New Year.I myself.I spent it at in the spittle working on Christmas.I'm fairly certain that you would was surfing along the the southeast and Southwest and coast of Western Australia.
No, I was not away.I do sometimes just like all the emergency services.This is our busy time of the year.So now I was working.I was actually working at doing Veterinary work.It's not always just surfing but it was good in between lots of lots of good family time we out we had our Christmas.
This actually at New Year's Day on New Year's Day, so and that was a real good time and it was really good to separate the the family time away from work time.Sometimes as emergency veterinarian.Do you want to fit in family time on Christmas time?
But for me Christmas is where the rest of the the team at AES and I'm sure Mercy vets around get to have their biggest impact on the public, but let's get back to it before we Zeus today's guest you'll notice that we discuss one of our listeners questions in this episode.
If you have a burning question that you want answered remember to send us an email at the vet Vault podcast at gmail.com or by messaging us on Instagram back to this episode.We're excited to kick off the new year with today's guests Carolyn Crow worked for 11 years as an equine bitten both UK New Zealand before deciding to shift her energy from primarily helping animals.
To helping people by becoming an award-winning personal performance coach Mentor International speaker researcher and lecturer.She has a master's degree in Workplace Health and well-being and continue to research this field.She's a master trainer in disc behavioral profiling a CPC a be trainer in Stress Management and well being a certified trainer and resilience and Mental Health First aider and a nunnery lecturer at the University of Liverpool.
She was a boarded life coach of the year in 2015 at the international coaching Awards.She became an honorary fellow of the coaching Academy in 2016 and a founding member of the coaching of Excellence accreditation in 2019.So basically when it comes to building a fulfilled career in veterinary science or anywhere for that matter, you want to hear what Caroline has to say, she's passionate about helping others equip themselves with the tools and strategies to get the most out of their personal and professional lives.
After successfully running her coaching and training business for several years Caroline works as a training consultant with the vet defense Society training team in the UK developing training and coaching individuals teams and practices to be the best they can and to thrive both personally and professionally.
She's getting someone who loves a challenge.So in 2017, she proved this point by running 10 marathons in 10 days raising over a hundred thousand pounds for the brook charity, which is not bad for someone.Only ran her first marathon in September of 2016 outside of work Carolyn is a wife of a vet mother of two small children and what she describes as a keen Runner which I'd say sounds like a bit of an understatement.
We cover a wide range of topics in our conversation with Carolyn like some the most common problems that she encounters with their clients and a favorite solutions to these problems also about building resilience and self-awareness and why coaching In is important and who's it for and of course how to prepare for running 10 marathons in 10 days when you also have a business to run and two young kids and more importantly why you'd want to do in the first place Carolyn also answers a tricky listener question about a situation that I think many of our listeners will have to deal with at some point in their careers.
Please enjoy.Let's say together on three together going to get in.There you go for any government, please enjoy Caroline Crow.And welcome back to another episode of the vent valve.
We've had a bit of a break over the Christmas season, like everybody else.Hopefully and we are back with Caroline Crow.I almost said dr.Caroline Crow bit in the UK.You don't get to call yourself doctor.Is that right?We can now but and so some do and say when people are qualifying now that they do but then for Old-Timers like myself We often we often don't wow, I never knew that do you get to you get to choose now, or do you have to have a chest say?
Oh gosh, I'm gonna get my date stay long but two or three years think it's been so then we now qualify with the as a okay.So all they're all the new graduates are now doctor whoever and and we can certainly adopt that if you want tea and so that was a choice that we could make two or three years ago only can still do that can still call myself I wanted to do But but I haven't okay.
I was quite disappointed.I qualified in South Africa we had dr.And I was Doctor for about a month and then moved to the UK so they lost my title again and when it had moved to Australia we call ourselves exactly the upgraded again.
I want to start off with something non-work-related.Just reading up on you Carolina.I saw that you ran a couple of years ago 10 marathons in 10 days.When did the obvious question is?Why the hell would you do that?
How do you sirs toys then?Why not?So yes that was in 2017, and it was probably one of the The best experiences I've ever had in my life.It was well amazing thing I've ever done and but but when I come back to a lot of people said why why are you doing this?
I have you you mad and because I wasn't a runner.So I told you I did it for 2017 as it came up to sort of by September 2016 was my first-ever Martin and prior to having that my children who thousand and eight for the vast.
That I didn't learn I was scared to Jim and be very sporty but I never arrived.I thought people who value a little bit Bonkers and so I but I was actually having a bit of a midlife crisis suppose.I was turning 40 in 2017.
I think as you get older certainly I just had lots of sort of a spasm life events through friends who have been injured or got really ill and haven't been able to do what they want to do.Do I we had a we got a friend whose son is about to be two, uh University and he was suddenly became quadriplegic and a car accident and he would be the person who always would have just gone.
Yeah, I'll do that and I just thought well if I can then I will try and I also said that that was a really really big impetus what happened to Bob and no one was in my work I talked about I have this little exercise I do with people I ask people to think about when they're 80 and think about the stories that they're going to tell their grand children or the people that they love because I don't have grandchildren and and I think for me one of the stories I wanted also do something out of my comfort zone and something and I wanted to create my story so and actually things like Eddie Izzard money his first marathon days, and we thought if he could do it I could Rachel please try and I wanted to inspire my children that point the kids were nine and seven and and I just thought you know, they have a they have a nice life, hopefully and they but I want them to go to see that actually if you push yourself you like stuff comes from if you try and work hard and train and have a goal and and to inspire them to take themselves out of their comfort zone not straight away obviously, but in time.
I don't know if I always wanted to really raise a lot of money for charity and to do one one big sort of thing.So I and I love it.I love a challenge.I've always loved the challenge.So I decided to I wanted to raise money for the book and a hospital because for me that was a really nice symbiotic.
Do you help the people you help the animals?And if you help the animals you help the people and what I now do in my role is Ian and I move away from my clinical work on helping animals directly to helping people Help the Animals the so it's sort of it was a nice.It's part of its really really good fit.
So the book is helping equids and horses donkeys and mules in the course communities of the world and by supporting them and supporting those who look after them that hope you make better have a big impact for more for not only animals, but also the people and so it was a definitely a combination of those I'm just thinking like why why not we always put things off we always is never a good time.
I was probably the kids were still young.My husband works as an equine vet.He's more than full-time.My job was I was just getting it repaired in my business to sell and I was the busiest.I've probably been for a long time that point.
We don't know what's around the corner and if I didn't take that opportunity that opportunity might have gone so I and to create that as a goal and did it with a friend guy called Brian Butler.He's also a bet so we did we call it 10 to London.
We had one official math and which was the last one which is the lender math them.So he went to the 10-day or nine days up to the London Marathon.That was our tenth amazing amazing.That's incredible.Wow, Alex my partner and I robbed their business partner we The kokoda challenge which is a hundred and know they say it's 96 case but turns out to be like a hundred and six exactly never quite kind of get the calculations right given the altitudes like five Club.
Yeah altitude.Okay.Gosh that was really hard and every freeze to run like atk's a week and then every Friday we didn't Marathon but that kind of destroyed me.I could not imagine doing 10 marathons every one every day in a row.
How'd you like Jessica?It is it's a mindset.Actually it was it was probably the simplest time of my life since probably being a child because it was planned.So we had a really good support team.They were key things that we did one was like I went and found lots of experts so I went and spoke to a guy called Greg White who is Olympic pentathlete, but he's also he's the guy behind Eddie Izzard and behind we have thing in the UK.
Sport relief well of celebrities do challenges and so Greg is the guy behind then running swim and Davina McCall's bike rides and ambitious.It's tough.So lots of he's just he's brilliant and they've got a couple of friends who know him and said I should go speak to him.
So, you know, it's amazing SUV just ask and so many people are really willing to sort of get that it times.He said yet come up to London appears this Harley Street practice.It's a really wicked and then He took me out for coffee, and he just gave me an hour of his time.
It was probably the most valuable our that I had in that preparation time and that was in November.So I was literally day for London bet show them 2016 and I remember him since that are sitting there saying you need to be really comfortable running marathons in training and I remember thinking I think it took me a week to Right now and then and he says like your support team that most important everybody needs that and it just a classic for the thing about teamwork.
Everybody needs to know their role when like all the answers going to be on you and your in Brine and actually everybody in that in that van is going to get tired.So everybody needs to be supported and you need to have a strategy around how to work together and what that looks like and think about do those If then planning think about what happens if you get injured on my math and to what you're going to do next everyday you finish math and just is not about what a finish that is about.
How do I prepare for the next day?So it was a very much around a lot.A lot of anti can just apply changes nor Life's a strategy team work setting yourself up recovery and training and seeking advice and seeking experts that the training was the hardest bit definitely.
Because it was lonely and going I would get up at the weekend at five and go for a while and still be running at 11.I remember going out once a Saturday and I was a friend of mine saw me about eight o'clock in the morning.And then she saw me at 11 o'clock as well.
And then when you're not still running I was like, oh my God, but actually when we did the math ins for the 10 days, it was really simple because all I have to do.It was put One Foot In Front Of Another and 1/4 and 1/2 hours.
That's what I like to do.Anything else didn't have any other pressures on me.I just had to run and that was that was really empowering.Actually.It was really it was really simple.It was really simple it hurt.So, where were you at this stage?
We still clinical wedding or had you been so I transitioned so I transition in 2013 2012 2013 so I was purely coaching and training practice, but I was just about to sell my business to the vet each principality at that point.
So I sold in July so are setting up for that.So what business was there that use that you sold and currently coaching.So my sort of Bentley part of Co and Co coaching.I sold to the better defense Society who are professional Indemnity insurance in the UK.
Yeah.And so we then set up the VDS training.So I still learn Caroline coaching from my lawn bats.I work with professional athletes and Medics and some other high performing pressures were quite a lot of Engineers Senior Management teams in schools, like on the side I stays but all my bet work is within VDS training.
So where there's the The insurance companies there to pick up the pieces when we make a mistake of EDS trading.Our impact is what our aim is to try and prevent those mistakes happening in the first place because they're in a very privileged position and within the profession where we know why people make a mistake and it's generally it's not because of a lack of clinical technical skills, but it's due to poor communication or people are getting stressed and so they are not focusing on the here and now they're so their heads full of what happened 5 It's it go there word about surgery coming up or they're not looking after themselves.
So they haven't eaten or had taken a break or there's a toxic culture and people aren't sharing information or its maybe their own sort of levels of expectation and perfectionist perfectionism, which are potentially again tripping them up and so by hopefully training them training people in the human factors and helping them become more have that higher.
A of resilience improve the cultures in which we work in to coach people to perform at their best then hopefully the aim is to reduce the risk of making an error in the first place, which will then impact on our insurance company.
So hmm.And are you still doing that coaching?So you sold the business but it's still you doing it?Yes.I'm me and then also a team so it's so the great thing now is where I'm in a we're in a cross the profession and we've got a team of seven.Is he between coaches and trainers as well?
So yeah, so AB 70% Isaiah a lot of every day.I'm either do one on one coaching.We got group coaching programs created a leadership program resilience of providing at work workshops.
We've got online platforms as well returning to work with confidence.They just they're trying to support people at every stage of their career.So working with the undergraduates at the University to do quite a bit of training with that.We would have a student membership group.
And then we do a lot of new graduate training.So helping people manage that transition period and then and then all the way all the way through so and then a lot of leadership, I love doing the leadership area.
So either personal leadership and also then helping helping Days in leadership positions get the best out of themselves, but also get the best out of those that they work with as well and many people as am sure you're very well maybe people go into leadership positions within the BET question and and lots of other questions and answers one of the really common things because they're good at what they do.
So there's in there good technically or good clinically or they've been in that role for a long time.And so they're bitter career progression is sort of moving into that management laws that might be owning a practice or coming a clinic or director or head of tea, but actually they don't many of them don't actually like people and or that or they do like people they do want to do a really good job, but because they are probably also really good at what they do instead of a higher turnovers.
And so they have unless you've got time to take away from their clinical staff to invest time into their interfere, but ideally their coaching leadership role.I'm say they then feel very squeezed as well.So we're getting quite a lot of burnout in people in those in the senior positions as well because they're trying to do the best they can do for their team whilst also in trying to deliver the the amount of turnover that they need to that.
They're sort of position requires of them and and they did their squashed them.They just haven't got time.They're not allocating time or time not being allocated for them to to do all the roles that they need to do in their in their work.
It was quite often.That's kind of you still have to maintain productivity as well as because is being a star performer or I have a high performer, but well someone who can build rapport really quickly generate good have good Revenue not having many complaints you still expected to do that while then step up into a role that they haven't had any prior leadership training let alone management training.
And let management leadership completely two different things is two different things is two different things management leadership and being a team player may need to do all of those things all the time.And and the common thing that we have said is that I hadn't have got time.How got time time time.So when you ask them, okay, how much time do you have time allocated your clinical work yet and up.
Do you have time allocated to your management stuff?No, but that's that's the fundamental principle.If you don't have time allocated to your roles, you won't have time to do it.You might have the best of interest and 10.Option but you won't have time.You just can't you're between a rock and a hard place.
I have this there's belief that everyone should undergo leadership training and I'm sure all the components of your of would you roll out to students involve some aspects of that?Because generally what happens is a student goes out and they graduate and they become a veterinarian they go into a role which generally puts them in charge of people or having to make decisions based on the clinical management.
Decisions based on invoicing billing complain to management all the sudden because people refer to them for their judgment they are then put in a position of leadership, which they don't realize that they're in.Yeah and and percent say my first day that we do for the new guy just called personal leadership and probably one of my first comp my first questions to them.
Is he who sees themselves the leader in this in this room?And very few of them do but they are they're leading their clients every day are leading their their team.But leadership is doesn't reach.
It doesn't need to come with a title and also fundamentally, we need to lead ourselves effectively every day and this the tools and techniques that we learn to lead others.Actually we need to Matt take on the far south and low model.
Absolutely because otherwise we won't be effective.But yeah, I take the agree that leadership is I just think it's Bonkers in many so many other professions you would not be given a leadership position without going through some training and yet sometimes trading a scene a bit like a dirty word like a like why don't need like why don't need that.
I'm about I can do all these things and yeah, we can all do most things.But if a we got time and be we've had training, we're not born with all these skills make me forget that we've just done five six years of intense nine till five plus plus plus hours of of training to to do our day-to-day role and we sort of forget we still see these skills and soft skills, but they're not there their heart.
They are so hard and only makes which is why people actually don't want to do them because it actually starts to challenge you of how maybe the maybe the strategies and the ways in which you've been working and living have got you to where you are now, but then they start to hold you back and and being able to re-evaluate and just just check in with yourself and think about what is working.
What isn't working.What do I want to continue to do?What do I need to stop doing?What do I what do I need to learn?What do I need to start doing?Is is it is such an important skill to have straightaway but also all the way through our careers and our lives.
I totally agree with you saying they're about the skills that have gotten to where you are have gotten to where you are.But ultimately that your strong suits which will ultimately be then that armor which will hold you back.It's it's, you know, like you can only progress so far with this because you have a new to go next level you either so yeah stop doing well.
Hold you back and start the meeting you they will live in label you to actually step forward and some people don't see that just think I'm a good keep on trying harder and harder doing the same thing.Hmm as opposed to actually be evaluate.Yeah if you think about it, so I mean is it gonna be big generalizations?
But what we tend to do is before you before so during school, we we know what we need to do to pass exams.You can you know where to go to learn.You can create the Environments that might be with a bit of music, but generally by yourself working with your books concentrating focusing reading and writing your exams, and that's fine.
Then you get into the enter and you do all your EMS and you do all your not your mess, but you do all your work experience and you can you're sort of in control all those different arms and you can you can build you and you're getting food into University and have a bit of a realization that actually you you want.
Top of the game and that that could be actively and is there are many many more expect to have more intelligent people but actually hopefully always realize that that isn't actually that important but he again you can you can work hard you can learn things.
You can hide yourself in the library.You can you can practice practice practice practice practice and I think about at University.We've basically taught that an animal comes in with these animal comes in with these Signs we have this list of differentials.
We do these tests and then we get this outcome, but actually what then happens when we qualify so we can pass the exams.We don't have to pass exams.Then what happens when we qualify is the animal comes in.It hasn't read the textbook so we don't actually know quite what that picture looks like the client might not be on the same page as us because we want to do X y&z, but actually they might want to do something different.
No, they're not.We feel that they're not listening or then we might want to do all those tests and that might be ideal or gold standard as we sort of hold ourselves to expect with but then the maybe the practice hasn't got the equipment.
The client hasn't got the money.You haven't got time in order to make the a think about it or and all do it.And then if we're not careful, we suddenly start to feel like we have failed.And and we failed to deliver best standard like best or gold standard sort of treatment.
And again, it's not because we says know about not trying and it's not about not trying to do our best.However, it's recognizing that we have been taught things in often.We've taught things in such a way that you can hold us back and then we also set ourselves to hold ourselves to those expectations.
And actually there's so many uncontrollables, but we We've gone through into a system where we have been very controlled and being able to control our environments and control our outfits to a situation where actually we need to work with people.We need everybody else's unpredictable our own emotions article as well.
And and then we can't we're not When we're not God, we are not a we can't fix everything.We can only our world they much as to help others make the best most informed choices for the animals under their care rather than to save and fix everything so managing our own expectations through that period of change where it's sort of all seem to be this is what I'm going to do when I qualify and most people will I win.
In tibetan area because they want to work with animals.Where is actually the majority of the jobs were thing about working with people.So when I work with and the undergraduate, I think they think I've literally lost but when I sort of asked them how many of you wanted to go into Veterinary?
Why you invest let's go is it because you want to work animals and they will put their hand up right and it made it finally and then I said how many of you would love to maybe been adopted we didn't really want to work people I'd say on average 60 to 70 people century.Two people put their hand up.
Yeah.That was me.I remember saying that first year.Yeah.And then what's how much of our job is people 95% We are in Veterinary.We are a client service industry.It's not about the animals.It's about the animals.
I think a bit of a byproduct it's about people and then we can get to the animals but we can with our role is very much a mattress.We're certainly a my CVS is to do the best for the animals under our care, but that doesn't mean Actually fixing them or doing what's in our head that's just best for that situation with animals.
So we need to learn that flexibility and that not everything is black and white and and and also just that realization of expectation.So the other question I ask people is when did they when did they decide to be a bet?
So for you to when did you decide to be a vet?And yeah, yeah right at the end of school.Yeah.I was like 21.Are you were late?Yeah.Yeah.I love I love science.
I loved medicine and Physiology and I picked it because I didn't want to wear with humans effective.But it one thing I realized when I was a student.I was actually librarian and I was dealing with a public.
All the time and I soon realized actually that I really like to talkin to people and I really like interacting with people and over the last couple years I get so much more enjoyment now, I love the clinical challenge, but it's a really seen the impact you can have on people family.
Yes.Yeah, and you really create winning and high-value trusting like I trust in relationships.Yeah - as quickly as you can that is the challenge.I find ya where's my mind?Different I was I didn't enjoy the Glide I'm sociable.
I enjoyed friends, but I found the client has actions really stressful and and didn't like it and try to avoid it and focused too much on the on the animal but it was 10 years into my career that I learned that lesson the jurors.It says that that is actually where the where the joy in the job is yeah, and now I'm much better at and I like it more and more and but yeah first is I didn't like being a vet because of because of that aspect of it.
Yeah, and it is Finding finding the bit.So if people when people go in for the animals or they go in actually for that scientific stimulation and academic academic semester, that's so a lot of people go in.They think they want to be about so before the age of 10, and so then that that carries some food.
So obviously that's a very informed Choice and then but then it actually often becomes there's an app.There's a significant number of people who actually then becomes Maybe Their parents choice and they feel they don't want to let people down and then that's why they come about and it's not necessarily they don't own it.
So you can learn to own that yourself that's actually fine or it's actually then that's when they need to start to make choices about what they want to do the rest of their career and then a lot of other people were sort of say it's where I'm sort of sticking 1617 when they were good at science.
They looked at what they could do with their science, they like that academic stimulation.But again if we look at the role Jen, It's about people and it's very routine.It's not that obviously there are some jobs which are like really stretching the boundaries of what we can do and very academic stimulating but General day-to-day work actually even if you were the top orthopedic surgeon its root is routine.
It's routine people routine baby after 12 months of challenge learning ordinarily be the first couple of years.I think the first couple of years is like that it is like you are you are learning.There's no two ways.He's about it.Everything's new and thinks everything's a challenge but then afterwards then it's becomes routine and but rather than being bored by that or being disillusioned by that that's when we start to actually look at like actually it is about people and this is really interesting like that's be intrigued by people and how we can get those bonds and build that Rapport and have that trusting relationship with them and do more and have that bigger impact and that's where that's where I think actually we can be really stimulated and really Interested and and learn to love our job again and we will go through different cycles of learning to love our job and that's okay and that's normal.
That's not because you hate your job and that you therefore need to leave being a vet.It's actually just that some normal cycle that most people go through their careers and I think getting used to that.So again rather than that three or fixed mindset it's having more of that growth mindset of where we learning and growing developing all the way through Because again, if you think about it often by the time we are 22, we've done our life goal to be a vet.
Mmm Yeah, and then what know what's that?Like, what's one of your at but but what I look like, so would you would you say that the cycle is like two to three years like two three years of Challenge and all of a sudden you've kind of realized that you've exceeded and now 90% of what you see is the same thing and you have your spiels and you're like, okay.
I'm either going to change profession or Direction to a specialty then it's a two or three years and then all the sudden you've learnt what you need to learn there.Maybe longer.Is there a do you feel it?There's like a because for me personally, it's about every two years that I feel that I recreated my career.
I've always a veterinarian and a fair chunk of our bulbs to a veterinarian.Yeah, some people have Cycles a bit longer and then there's a yes about if you think about it, we will probably be quite good at something after you've done it for a couple of years.So I first bit is like quite exciting.It's quite right.
Siting straight daunting straight like you out of your union stretch Zone.And then as soon as you come back into your comfort zone will probably in our comfort zone for a year 18 months and be quite happy with that.And then for some that they will stay there and that's actually fine again looking at sort of our personalities and how the environments we want to create that ourselves others will want to be looking for that next challenge and but it doesn't always have to be from work as well.
I think people too often.We put too much emphasis that work has to fulfill Us in everything.In life and actually so sometimes it's then actually work is fine and work is steady and that is okay.But I'm going to choose to then do they got bit more energy now because work is of not spending all manager at work, then that's maybe one I go and do a challenge outside of work or do have some other interests outside of work and that's that's a good thing.
I think we When we think about our status and what we how we see ourselves, I think it's really important to always and this is one thing I've learned over time is that I work as a bit so I don't work as a clinical bit, but I never did I my I work as a baby.
I'm not a vet.I ordered my admired entity is me as Caroline is my identity is not a vet.My identity I'm not I'm not so who are you I'm Caroline Crow.I'm a mom.I'm a wife and I love life.
I work as a coat a leadership trainer, but it's not it's not who I am.It's not everything to me.So it's very is a big big part of my life.It's Ben's I spend a significant amount of my time on it, and I love what I do and it's incredibly important to me, but it doesn't Define me so I think But I think historically I've always said mainly because it's quite easy.
I'm a vet didn't have to release anything else and it and it says there's a status attached to that as well.And so it just smells it and also what other people think it's so I think it was easy for parents and friends and family to to say to to say in a way that then obviously they're very proud of that which then makes it mainly when we're struggling.
Is our job it carries a lot more baggage than it probably should do but it but it still does.So what happened?Tell us about your move from clinical practice into other things?
How how did that happen?Why did it happen What was what was what was your story?Well, that's right.So I was I was it's that bat.I worked in the UK were to New Zealand fundamentally loved being a clinician love my work.
We're going to see every day was a Bed of Roses, but I really loved it.I had a great team worked in a very we worked really well together have some four of us.I'll study writer so step number lately.So I did that for 11 years.So qualified 2002 and finish finish that in 2013.
I think over time I got more interested in people and I said, I'm married to a neckline surgeon and he ends up working in the same practice Victor's or great.He's in hospital as a ton about so wasn't really like actually working together.
I'd been asked if I want to be a partner, but I knew that Ali would also be I asked so actually I said well I didn't say but like I did so I thought it'd be totally unhealthy to have two partners in in the in the relationship.So one was fine.It was fine.I had had my two children.
So I took a year off with each of them and then went back to work part-time.And for me part time was I worked six in the morning till one o'clock in the afternoon so I can still do my stud around and I did that for mornings a week and then a full on call so I'm not really sure how part-time that is.
Like it was definitely just as part-time but I I suppose got into that routine bit.Really.I knew I could so I used to do a lot of obviously just standard repo work.
I used to do a lot of freezing semen and semen analysis about a couple of papers that so I don't know that sort of a lot within that part of the creek my career and I could have done I could have carried on doing that the next 20 years and that's fine.
But I just wanted to do more but I had different skills and probably ignore the people part that was interesting to me.I was the first bet to get pregnant in our practice as they mail at that point of a male practice and they didn't have a clue.They were really supportive but literally didn't have a clue and I didn't have a clue what I was doing and what I could do or not do and then I was probably also the first of my uni mates to get pregnant as well.
So when they then got pregnant they are Me what?I did how I worked and I thought there's nothing out there for our profession to help women go through this stage of both being pregnant most whilst working what you can and can't do what you should and shouldn't do and then also when you return to work how that works and again going through the drop of confidence and the uncertainty and then trying to juggle it with kids and I call that sort of just the normal.
More stuff of the turn back but so I think somebody suggested that I should I wanted to do more.I want to go into management role.I know that I didn't want to do that within our practice.So again, I didn't think that was particularly healthy and didn't really want to work for another practice either because I loved my practice.
So I looked at what else was out there.I then a comment below what actually led me to the coaching but And did a two-day coaching tasted a and I will put my hand up and I will I will say I thought that coaching was probably like a lot of it horse vets was a bit.
I thought I'd have to wear sandals and to and had trees to be honest and it was all about airy-fairy and wishy-washy and that's not me and and I am out to this two-day Taste of professional answer back then put.Oh my God.
This is most pragmatic positive.Practical thing that and way of seeing life and doing things and like this this is me.This is like, this is absolutely what I want to be doing.We've also had we've had I think doesn't just take a couple steps back.
I remember being really surprised what beginning of my career of how many of my friends didn't enjoy their job and weren't weren't thriving and I now realize that I was in a very supportive environment.And and but at the time I thought could kind of just spent five years training for this what you mean is you enjoy it and I said I'm not going to say it every day is better ways, but fundamentally, I really really enjoyed it.
And and also we've had over 10 15 myself and as we've had over 10 friends or colleagues who've committed suicide and those are all really big pushes to do something more for the people and and each one obviously has a big impact.
T' and and it just it it is a waste and it doesn't need to be like that.But and at the time think a lot of people would talk starting to starting to talk faster and 2012 or people start.There's a lot of research coming out around suicide and I thought we should yes if we need to talk about this, but also we need to be talking like it if you'd like 30 steps behind like a while in front of behind that we need to prevent people getting anywhere near that stage.
So what can we do to help people thrive and because fun?At the end of the day, it's just a job just stop and I know it can be really all looking to consuming and Etc, but it's just a job.So, how can we help people get more so did my coaching diploma to start off with and then I went on and did diplomas in I realized straight up.
Well quite early on that actually a majority of the things people come into coaching from had a they'll select stress element.And so then I went on a diplomas and Stress Management in and then resilience training. for both individuals and then also the managers of teams and then I did my masters degree in Workplace Health and well-being which is basically workplace stress, and I qualified with my master's degree in 2016 in 1627, 2016-2017 and forth those deep into the into the that side of things into the coaching and the skills and the knowledge you would need to help assist the people or have the framework supposed to Sister people that you will Coach you and then have a bigger impact you started to realize that it's beyond the one it's now teams.
Yeah, definitely and I think for me I miss might be another vet thing but to be properly qualified for something that was really important.So I'd say I need to be a qualified coach.So that was a really important way to gain the skills and to gain the the level of the skills that work that was important and then to have that so I like to look at things in a quite a strategic holistic in terms of like most things are multifactorial and I think we need to have Frameworks and structure.
There's not although we might just see one like problem in inverted commas.And actually there's often lots of different things which are leading up to that and which we need to be able to take that step back and look at it from different angles.So being able to have the knowledge and the structures and the systems and the tools and the techniques to help people unlock themselves and stick themselves and when they find found to be really stuck from different angles because everybody's different so it's not one size fits all if it's all at all and and that was that was really important for me to be able to do so resilience is a residence is not a personality characteristic residences is a way of working a way of being And it's something that we need to learn and it's a it's an active process so you on I am not Vasily until you are not resilient.
I have a degree of resilience to the environment.I'm in that moment, but I need to make sure that I feed my resilience because every day something will be draining it.So I need to know what works for me as well as what trips me up.And so there's no point making people resilient and then making them then work in a very top.
Sick environment or with a toxic manager or so you need to have the zillion individuals or people with a high level of resilience individuals working in a resilient team working in a resilience profession.So it's which then means that ability to be flexible and adaptable and to see the future and to pick stuff up and you get hit down but to learn from it and to grow and to develop.
So again having that for me the Workplace Health and well-being Masters as gave me that much much bigger.Oversight of of culture and how to do things better and from that we've created the culture survey where we can help teams by serving them anonymously within their roles to look at.
What are the a what's not working.Also what's working?Well, so I think what I'd like to do for 2020 is to start to change the conversations in the profession from that one of being someone of being negative because I think a lot of the social media at the moment has been Certainly recently his is still quite negative about expecting burnout expecting and around burn around suicide around toxic cultures around that it so everybody else's fault.
Bob negative clients like a lot of negativity.Whereas actually let's I want to turn it into a lights change of conversation into let's look at what we love about our jobs and what we love about our lives and how can therefore we do more of those things?
So by look at helping teams look at Be aware of what's not working.So they know what to change also what's working?Well so that we can then focus on those and do more of that because that will have as equal.If not more of an impact than just changing the negative.It's some some of those some of those things you can't even change.
Yeah.Absolutely like yeah how we how we gonna do and this is one thing that I'm like I totally agree with you saying because we can only really change or you can control right?Yeah anything changed the whole entire team you can change the environment of the teams in In that's like that's really in control.But like changing maybe maybe I just don't see it as a really kind of if I was going to best my energy somewhere investment in gene something that I know.
I have an out-and-out come in as opposed to expecting clients to change and even then it's our perception of apps are their behavior which makes it negative.Like yeah people grieve in different ways.We can't expect them to behave in a particular way, you know and And also I think it's somewhat selfish that we have this expectation of how they should treat us when we might treat our mechanic that same way.
Yeah.Absolutely.Yeah, it's always about what you can control and then what you can influence and hopefully we can in fact we can only I can only control what I say.What I do how I feel how I behave I cannot control what you say what you do what you say how you behave?What'd you think - I can influence that by again what I say what I I do how I behave how I act but and there is always a reason behind our Behavior and the behavior of clients or behave of colleagues.
So, how are we and again expectation?So a lot of people will say oh but there are so disrespectful.Well what just respect look like have you do they might not even be aware that they're being disrespectful you're putting your dad actually adding a massive level of judgment on somebody else's behavior and think it's a some majority people we were With majority of our clients are not Psychopathic as and they don't intend to come in and upset you and yet you have been offended or upset or made Angry by what they have said or done.
And actually what you've done is you have chosen to be upset or angry or overly sensitive to that.So and that's about a choice of what you can do.So know that there may be some people who trigger you and then just submit acknowledging that and thinking well, how am my going to what am I going to do?
How am I going to behave?How am I going to feel?I'm putting some emotional buffers in there.So little bit of a know that mrs.Jones is going to come from in know that she's going to go on and on and on or going to complain or she's going to get angry or whatever whatever the emotional they throw at you but then think about how you're going to choose so they have less of an impact.
Do you still need to see?Mr. James?You still all you make me still need to work in a small environment like a small but there's why why are you choosing to be stressed by that?D-Day like she's where to expand your emotional energy.And that's it.That is a choice and that's the it's very easy to sit here and say that that's my choice and it's hard to do but that's where we can learn and that's what we can learn to do.
And that's what you've learned to do through a lot pitching is about choosing our behaviors and choosing our responses and choosing how we're going to feel because we are all emotional being said, it's not about being an emotional robot, but Only I can decide whether I have a good or bad day.
So not whether I work with somebody or I have certain cases or I see certain clients.Actually.I'm going to decide whether have a good or bad day.And that's about me putting myself back in control of my driving seat and seeing where I'm going to focus my energies and I'm so going to do exactly the same things as I did yesterday, but I just going to I'm going to choose to have a better day today because I'm going to decide what I what I allow to affect me. and again, I think when people are if you're unaware of yourself and unaware of your behaviors, and you're just being you in that reactive State, then it's easy to go through the day sort of being basically in gratitude from one post to another and not and then you and the end of the day you are totally emotionally wrung out because you've been up and down and all over the place and because of every interaction you had It's about being a little bit more in control of what you're doing and how you're processing things and how you're working.
So, how do you how do you learn this?How do you practice it?Because at this is all the stuff you're talking about.I am sorry brutally aware of I've learned as I know it and on a good day.I'm good at it and then it goes wrong and even though I catch myself up self aware that it's that it's happening and we're going I'm reacting so mostly to this and I don't One two, sometimes I still suck at it.
Sometimes I did the end of the day I go.Well, I totally failed it.Yeah and making the right choices of how I want to be and and then deciding to have a good day.How do you practice it with you?Go to for resources.What's your recommendation to get better at that?Well, I think if you're catching yourself, I think that's and have it's a self-awareness.
I think to start off with is the absolute fundamental starting point.So for so we use this but dis Behavior profiling to help us become more self-aware.So you're not born with self awareness self.Awareness is something you have to learn and you and some people are have been affected and this is not about navel-gazing and and pontificating about life.
So I think some people think it is, but it's actually just about being like what what works for me.Why do I do what I do one of the environments that that feeds my feed me and give me Energy, what are the environments that drain my energy so you can go into the eyes wide open each day and know what you need to put into your day.
So to start off with sort of bit sort of having a bit of a blank sheet of paper and think about what do I need to do each and every day that enables me to have a greater chance to have a better day.So that might be I need to practice in some quiet time.It might need something.I need to patch and some social time.
It might be that I need to factor in some exercise time.I know that if I If I run before I start work it running I'm I'm just it sets me up.So yes a be lovely to go for an hour.And but actually if I can just be able 20 minutes I feel better and I can do that with my Labrador is even better like it just sets me up.
I also need to have some quiet time at some point during the day, but again just be 20 minutes, but I might go to do that driving driving towards getting the kids school and I just turn my turn the music off turn the video off, but actually again making those habits.Boo to do that and then also knowing when you are not at your best, so if it's when you haven't eaten or haven't slept very well.
So again in those those 60 times if you haven't if you've been out all night or being on call or you've been had a heavy weekend whatever it is know that you are going to have to be a little bit more on yourself for that next couple of days because you are your resilience has lower will stop and so therefore we're going to be more reactive.
Knowing also so with the disc profiling we it looks at whether like maybe with your more more of a sensitive style knowing what other things which are more like to press your sensitive buttons.So thinking about what I've just I feel like that they might not like me or dive offend them or upset them or and actually did they think about always what was the intention behind that person's Behavior.
So I really think they intended me to make me feel like this will have Chosen to feel like this.So again, you can start to just catch yourself as you go into those maybe ruminations or or if you're starting to become really reactive and speaking to your closest team members.
So I might be at work and your support network or it might be your family.And so that saying that this is this how you on your best day on your best and this is how you are when you start to these are the signs that you see in yourselves early on.On so that they can help you pull yourself out of that like really really early on I think and so knowing what what signs of prospect signs of stress you have.
So I think too often we just think things are our body's trying to tell us something and we just ignore it.And so we wait until we anger and frustration often real secondary emotions.So what happened earlier on in the day that then causes that anger to the or that in turn might be internal anger at my not yet.
Scandal and all that frustration is really building a white.Why is that it's because you haven't had some hot time is it because you haven't been able you continues being interrupted you haven't been able to complete and finish a task.And so what is it what's happening and then and then building that as a picture to help self out some people Journal as well so that they will write down say a little exercise in space to do is to every couple of hours in a day just write down right just checking myself.
Like how do I feel what's happened?What sort of interactions of I had and so you can start to see patterns to start off with the Lich just just couple of minutes every couple of hours just to see what what are the what are the triggers?What are the challenges?What are the what are also what the things that make you feel really good?
And then how can again how can you put those in so you might find that music really picks you up?So they might have about when you're consulting or something, but how can you have a man on the way home rather than what's yours?Technological Detachment and you doing from work to home or from one's own at work.
So Consulting into theater or theater and to consult like we have to wear different hats then how are you actively moving through those different roles or Manning as we talked about earlier management team fair to leadership on be really purposeful about the steps that you're making so you can be more present in the moment as you then go through these it won't and you go through and also are there for present in each of these its baseball's during the day but a lot of this practice and that's a reflection and feedback.
So that's why if you can speak to your team members and family members and people that you trust and you know, they're going to give you honest and be respectful of honest and respectful opinions, then that can help you can be a bit of a I provide start off with a little Bit uncomfortable, but that's that's not necessarily a bad thing.
I think too often.We don't get told things because people don't want to upset us and then and then we even realizing that we are having a big impact on other people which might not all be positive but we got no idea.
We need to know how we impact people on a date on a on a regular basis what works for you what works routine.So even if you're working in a team Just asking your like you're asking a nurse.I see you a section asking you the best what works for you when we're setting up to the theater.
What what doesn't what can we change what rather than always doing things in a certain way I think too often we hear I hear people say are we know I'm really self-aware.I know exactly how I am but this is how I am so tough, but that's that's not okay.That's be who you want to be outside of work.
They really don't care but inside the work that's not rational.Last night I made that is really just really damaging to your professional career.But also to the people that you work with and we often also here are you know, that's just them like they're they're like, they're the best surgeon or best practice manager the best nurse with the just you just have to allow them to have as outbursts.
No, it's not.Okay.I think a boy say the words it's not okay so many times each week and I'm working with teams that behaviors not okay, whatever's driving it.Let's find out what's driving it.But the behavior you need to be more professional and therefore be more in control and that's what that's what professional looks like to be flexible and that order to modify our behaviors to and therefore we need to be in that practice that rather than reactive.
And so anything we can do as an individual and a team and a practice and and works better to improve the situation is going to be fruitful for everybody and therefore also for the patient's under our care.Okay.Well, let's Let's put it into practice.
There's something we've been trying to do for a while with the podcast as listen to questions.And I think this is I have a question that I think this fits perfectly with and I'd love to listen to said send an email and I want to I'm going to read to this is not me.I'm quoting as the as the game.
So I just added I just started a new job one month ago and it's been going really well.It's a high quality practice, excellent standards of care and fair working conditions.I'm a collaborative and happy person can die.I love to get second opinions on my cases.I'm a few years out of uni, and I've but I have good experience from Big practices.
My new boss has been a GP wait for a long time and has worked hard to build up the practice and still works full-time.Clinically.The boss is supportive and helpful.But at times this could be stifling if it is uncalled for like coming into the consult room in the middle of my consult and take over which completely undermines me in front of the client.
I'm still called the new grad.We've had disagreements on treatments where I'm expected to administer treatments that I Is not necessary or safe which has led to an argument where I was told that I should respect 30 years of experience.I do respect that.I'm the employee but it's also my name going to the paperwork.
And I know I'm the one being pulled up by the vet surgeons board if something goes wrong.It's also very unsatisfying and not good for my confidence in morale.I'm not in a position to Simply switch practices due to my partner's job and it's a situation that leads me to feel stressed and unhappy I don't know where to go to for help.
So how would you coach this listener about?Well, the first thing I'd say is dated any think that optimizes your qualification.So if something is unsafe, it's just an egg a and whatever needs to happen to make that happen because that's that's your qualification.
But it's also saying that there are different ways of doing things and for me, it's about how the starting to have some conversations.She's that will that she he Revere's have said that they tried to have that conversation before but they've been told they just need to get on with it.
And so I would probably have more so when Technique we use is called the SBI technique for giving feedback to let you know that one's at so you describe the situation describe the behavior and just grab the it.Impact so you could say you could say, oh, he's I'm gonna say she didn't say so when you come into my consult room when I'm in when I'm with with their client and you make suggestions or contradict what I've just said the impact it has is it makes me it makes me feel really really undermined drops my confidence and I don't think and it's and it's often confuses.
The clients at that point.Is that the impact So you describe situation scribe Behavior described the impact you're not scrubbing them describe the behavior they showing and then you check in is that the impact that you are intending to have?If not, what can we do and how can we work together to have a better impact?
Okay, so you can say oh, it could be that when we're in front of clients and you describe me as a new graduate the impact it has it makes me feel young again.My confidence goes down.It makes me feel really quite small in the practice and not that significant or that you don't trust my opinions again, is that the impact that you're wanting to have?
If not, could we think about a different?Name, you have all the green not using the new graduate turn or could we?What could you just say that it's that introduced me as Caroline rather than the new graduate.So again, you you we need to make you need to be back the impact of the behaviors rather than them as a person.
So it's think about the intention does.She think her boss intends to make her feel stressed and unhappy to see in Ted.Does she feel that?Her boss intends to drop her confidence.And if the answer is yes, then the question is although it might be difficult is is that really the best environment for her to be in she also says that she loves to ask for second opinions though.
She always need to ask if she always asking him for second opinions.So actually it does does he is he thinking he's trying to help her by going in and helping her in her concert rooms is he?How is he does he think that he's Helping her by actually saying by calling her the new graduate, which they're maybe not he might be feeling that that then puts less responsibility on her as an individual.
Yeah, absolutely giving her a bit of a leeway.So I think more conversations need to be had around impact them and behaviors and working together, but then also so she to try and reduce the chance with reduced the That reaction of that stress reaction is for her to recognize that around that he said that again but while then he said that again and therefore it means X y&z, which she's been created in our hen ahead.
Actually.He said that again like that's my trigger right stop breathe and we use of 7-Eleven breathing.So we then for 7 seconds and out for 11 seconds.And if you do that three times at like over like a minute and a half When you get stressed, we get that adrenaline and cortisol Surge and it's racing on a body that's been hide UPS our brain get activation or sympathetic nervous system and all in all this or physical changes with that when we focus on our breathing and do what we call 7-Eleven breathing for 90 seconds.
It increases our vagal tone and switches on our path sympathetic nervous system.So it's the most effective way to change our physiology.So just to like let you stop breathe and then think what am I in control of what am I not in control?I can't control.So he's going to stand what he's going to do.I can control how I'm going to react and what I'm going to say, they like and sometimes it's about Rising above it as well.
So as long as you are not doing things which have been to put your qualification at this as long as you are it's not going to it's just ask yourself.Is it is it illegal?Is it immoral are you causing harm to the patient?Are you causing harm to your qualification?
If not, there are different ways of doing things and if he wants to do that.That then fine let the will play that game and I'm going to rise above it and I am move Georgia time again to be able to focus on what I can do and what I can influence but you know, sometimes I might need to do other things as well.
So rather than having that fixed mindset of a doing a or only be so great in that compromise and how you do things as long as it's safe and it's not a moral or legal or against your qualification starting to think about your the SBI how have have they actually Had a sit-down conversation not a time but in a way of saying and say to them, I'd love to have a conversation.
I'd love to have a chat with you.Can we have can be booked in a time for maybe an hour so we can just talk about how we're working together at the moment when would work for you in the next couple of weeks when would work for you?So you put them in control of setting the time frame but you've also said this is what I want.
So you manage expectations you could also if you think oh my Oh God, that's gonna be really hard conversation, which it really could be think about.How can you do you need to write some notes so you don't get hijacked during that meeting.Do you need to send those notes maybe to that put for the boss beforehand say these are things I'd like to discuss so, you know that you've already had that conversation so that again rather than simply might manage bring this up a nuclear sub, you've given them also time to think things through and think about how that because they do they might be mortified that they're having this in Most people don't want to drop their competence of their of their new budget.
They don't want you to be stressed.They don't want you to be unhappy, but those are real real feelings that you will really be having and it will make you feel really quite strapped by stuck quite lonely and quite isolated as well.So Recognize a you're not alone, but be a have a conversation and you might need to revisit that as well.
So having the conversation once doesn't mean that you're done and dusted and now everything for you because it's that pages and they'll be in the habit as you need to be able to be able to pull them up as well in a safe constructive way where it's going to be then better for them.
And because also you can talk about not only the positives of change of pace but also the consequences and I think changing because if this continues the reality is I'm going to continue to be stressed and therefore I don't think I'm going to as productive as I could be and I just know it's not working for me and do not giving them an ultimatum.
You just actually say in the consequences of nothing changing and if they're again if they're really happy with that then fine.But yeah, that's not the practice for you whatever bigger things that means.It's it's Point base.Again.It's multifactorial.
So having the conversations looking at the structure of those conversations of using is bi managing yourself in those situations until that they change their behavior being safe in your practice of how you do things and and noting the impact of those small things.
So writing it down and during a limit and having some talk things through so that you're not you're not alone only that's one of the powers pounds of painting as a It can bounce ideas also create your own network as well.You said this the currents but one of the powers of coaching you soon who knew believe need to coach and I would say not everybody all the time.
But everybody at sometimes so for me coaching is about enhancing our performance.I would love to get to a place where we see it as As in many other professions is a positive thing.I think for improving ourselves.
Like why wouldn't you want to perform better rather than waiting until we get broken and then we need to be coached and again that much more of a proactive proactive approach to it.So I'm a nun coached.I have a coach and it's just about again improving what I do and high performance.
And so if you want to let work at a high performance level you wouldn't expect yourself.As a sports person to be able to reach write and perform consistently healthfully and well without having a really good coach behind you to help you to hold your cuz I've counseled to do what you're doing to help you learn and grow and develop and get that feedback.
So there are everybody will need spray something different from coaching.Although there's some really common sense as well and and and it's finding a coach that fits you which is really important.It's a really personal relationship you have with them.
You need to feel better that you trust them and that they have got your back and they're going to hold you accountable but they're going to also feel it's like that real slow like a supportive glove.That's that really helps.You helps you help yourself and they've got you they've got your back and that's what that's that's what you To enter need from from your coach say and there aren't there are not student coaches out there.
So find one that fits fits what you need and what you want as well weird.How then how do you go to find a coach because it's I've looked and it's quite you Google coaches and it's just yeah.Yeah, definitely and I think there's a real challenge with coaches and coaching as a profession then it's unregulated.
So anybody can set themselves to The Coachman in half you're qualified.And so we I've just become a part of a coaching for excellence program to try and start to do this as this is not that me but this is outside to show Excellence within a group of coaches so that so that the buyer the coachee has somewhere to go to gain some some standard that somebody's going to be so that they're not going to be ripped off its often.
Decent amount of investment that you need to put nuts are not only financially but just in your time and your energy level and your and yourself, so I think I think it's very trendy.Thank you in the back new sector.I think it's very trendy at the moment.
And I think that's a dangerous place that people are becoming coaches without being qualified.So looking at people's qualifications doing a bit of homework.Obviously.I'll say VDS training.And we've all use we have for us because we are all qualified coaches and with high levels of there are there are others as well.
And there are things like the kitchen had me directory we would use as well.There isn't one because it's not a regulated profession.There's not one go-to place and word of mouth as well.So but again remember that everybody is different.
What really works one person started coaching really worked for one person might not work for another but find the one that works for you.Awesome.I think we should probably start wrapping up like I could talk to you forever.I think I might have to come back to you privately.
Yeah, but we'll start ramping up with out with a regular questions.Now, we generally are you a podcast listener?Yes, I am.Yes.Yeah any favorites.Why do I need to add to my to my list of podcast?Well, it's a very non very one but there is one had a massive impact on me.
And so it's called a tentative.It's called Beast of man.It's actually why your South African Kevin Peterson's podcasts a the cricketer England.He has done one as a radio 5 live as a BBC Radio 5 live is called Beast Man by Kevin pietersen and a bonnet and it's his passion.
The purpose his purpose around save another line a and in Africa and and it I can't stop thinking about it.Actually it is so it shows passion.It shows the impact of both good and bad of man on on animals and it I highly recommend it.
It is very very me.It was very very powerful.I love that one.Awesome and the show notes.Brilliant, excellent and derive you got anything else.The one question actually didn't really quite interested to hear and it is that final question as always is if you have a few minutes to give one piece of advice to all the new Veterinary new grads recent grads in the world.
What would that piece of advice be?So I think my piece of ice is understand your why so why you're doing what you're doing what is important to you in your life?And in your career know that your wine may change over time and that's okay.
So be the comfortable with that make sure it's your why and not your parents why or your partner's why but your why and this is this is your year your career.So do the things that you love not every day.I will I be not every day will be ideal.
But find the fun and the inspiration in your daily actions and make your life in your career work for you and only you can know what that looks like only you can know what your why is so take time to focus on you and make sure those small tweaks that you can make will have will make the difference that works for you in this next year.
And then also moving forward as well.Just follow on from there than if you had a resource for that.Would you direct them to Simonson textbook and start with your why?Or yeah or finding out which actually yeah.Yeah.Absolutely.Thank Simon Phoenix is great for that and then get the support of yeah, I would say get the support of a good coach to help you and pick your why and Own your own your wires.
Well, there's this perfect.Awesome.I've I want to jump in with one more.You mentioned a book to write it.I'm going to have to you're a coach you're gonna have a list of books.Have you got have you got book said that you could that you recommend that people have to read.
Yeah.So start with the why Simon sinek will be 1 and the chimp Paradox and mind management by dr.Steve Peters.That's a brilliant book around behaviors and the behaviors of our mind so you Have your sports he said was will be school psychologist self theories and mindset by Carol dweck fantastic books around differencing fixed and growth mindsets thing can really useful and I love Matthew Syed Black Box thinking bounce and and hit and his books drive by Daniel pink.
Thanks another really good one around our own motivation the motivation of others.And another one which was a real which was another real early one.I read checklist Manifesto by a tall Grande and I never thought that reading a book about checklist.We've been really exciting but it's good things and again the principles around culture that's really around what the medical field then the implementation of check this off the Record.
Stay there is phase of my there's a my go-to books.I think I would I throw one in just a little bit just a lot of other stuff.You said earlier on fits in beautifully with a book.I'm reading at the moment.I called Insight by Tesha Uric inside the power of self-awareness in the self to do the world really good one for anybody listens and wants to learn about self-awareness a little bit.
It's a great great read good.That was great.Thank you, very So much for jumping on and dump it on the podcast.So close after Christmas and New Year's then we people like to have a bit of a break during this time and do nothing.Thank you again so much.That was awesome.I think we should do it again.
Yeah.Thanks very much for asking me.It's been great fun.

Carolyne Crowe