March 22, 2024

#117: Purpose, Passion, and Persistence: Creating Unicorns For A More Resilient Veterinary Profession. With Dr Geoff Wilson.

#117: Purpose, Passion, and Persistence: Creating Unicorns For A More Resilient Veterinary Profession. With Dr Geoff Wilson.

In this episode, Dr. Geoff Wilson reflects on the transformative power of resilience and passion within the veterinary profession, drawing on lessons from polar exploration and wilderness survival. He discusses his journey integrating these principles into veterinary training to combat burnout and improve industry culture. The conversation highlights the development of a unique resilience program for new veterinary graduates, designed to push mental and physical limits while instilling confidence and adaptability in high-pressure situations. Dr. Wilson also examines challenges within the veterinary profession, from selecting candidates with emotional intelligence to addressing toxic attitudes that deter young professionals. The episode underscores the importance of maintaining positivity, embracing a service mindset, and fostering a supportive environment to ensure the longevity and fulfilment of veterinary careers.

Apple Podcasts podcast player icon Spotify podcast player icon RSS Feed podcast player icon
Apple Podcasts podcast player icon Spotify podcast player icon RSS Feed podcast player icon
Season 1

'Resilience' can be a very loaded word: where is the line between 'toxic resilience' that relies mostly on stubborn grit and self-sacrifice, and a deep sustainable resilience that stems from a much deeper place?

Dr Geoff Wilson is intimately familiar with resilience: veterinarian down to the core, Dr Geoff lives a vast and varied life split between being a family man, veterinarian, practice owner, entrepreneur, and expeditionist. Highlights from Geoff’s adventurer career include completing the longest solo, unsupported polar journey in human history, the fastest solo, unsupported crossing of Antarctica, the first to cross the Torres Strait by kiteboard, the first and only wind-assisted crossing of the Sahara Desert (2009), and the first wind-powered crossing of the Simpson Desert in Australia. Geoff’s newest adventure, Project Zero, is a net-zero docu-series documenting a voyage that explores some of the world’s most isolated and vulnerable environments and the visible impact of global warming on these landscapes, and engaging with the world’s leading climate scientists, advocates and initiatives.

You'd think that for someone like this, the challenges of working in veterinary science would be insignificant, but that's not the case. In this conversation Geoff takes us on a journey through the peaks and troughs of his own experiences in vet life, and beyond, shedding light on the dangers of pushing ourselves too far and the pitfalls of 'toxic resilience', vs utilising passion, purpose, and persistence to help shape true resilience. Geoff helps us explore how vulnerability, optimism and a service mindset support resilience, and he opens up about a unique program at his group of practices, VetLove, that is designed to cultivate 'unicorns' – exceptional vets who thrive under the weight of demanding expectations, and how they are trying to find that delicate balance of nurturing growth without breaking spirits.

Topic list:

03:29 From Polar Expeditions to Veterinary Practice: Jeff's Unique Journey

04:27 Cultivating True Resilience in the Veterinary Field

13:21 The Vet Love Resilience Program: Shaping Exceptional Veterinarians

35:49 Addressing the Challenges of Modern Veterinary Practice

35:49 The Importance of Support and Community in Veterinary Medicine

43:58 Navigating Difficult Clients: Zero Tolerance

45:38 Transforming Customer Service

46:55 Building a Positive Work Environment Amidst Challenges

51:44 Redefining Veterinary Education and Practice for Future Generations

54:20 The Power of Positivity

01:05:23 Balancing Passion with Personal Well-being

01:24:17 Final Thoughts: Embracing the Veterinary Profession with Optimism and Resilience

 

Join our community of Vet Vault Nerds to lift your clinical game and get your groove back with our up-to-date, easy-to-consume clinical episodes at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠vvn.supercast.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠.

Get help with your tricky cases in our ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Specialist Support Space.⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Join us in Japan or in Wanaka with Vets On Tour: email vetsontour@gmail.com for details. (And tell Dave we sent you for your 10% discount!)

V⁠⁠isit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠thevetvault.com⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠for show notes and resources related to this episode.

Connect with us through our online ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Vet Vault Networ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠k⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ for episode highlights, clinical resources, discussions, questions and support.

⁠Subscribe to our weekly newsletter⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠here⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ for Hubert's favourite clinical and non-clinical learnings from the week.

 

Resilience in Veterinary Practice: Building Emotional and Physical Toughness

The veterinary profession is inherently challenging, demanding a unique blend of technical skill, emotional intelligence, and resilience. As discussed in our previous conversation, modern veterinary professionals face numerous pressures, contributing to high stress levels and a concerning suicide rate within the industry. Building resilience is not about becoming immune to challenges, but rather developing the capacity to navigate them effectively and emerge stronger. This episode highlights the importance of proactive resilience training, particularly for new graduates, to equip them with the tools and mindset needed to thrive in this demanding field.
Here's a deeper look at resilience in veterinary practice:

Understanding the Challenges: Why is Resilience so Crucial?

  • The "Blood Sport" Reality: This episode aptly describe veterinary practice as a "blood sport", acknowledging the inherent exposure to suffering, death, and difficult situations. This raw reality, coupled with demanding clients and long hours, necessitates a certain level of mental and emotional toughness.
  • Unrealistic Expectations and Negativity: The episode highlights a concerning trend of negativity surrounding the veterinary profession, often originating from within veterinary schools. Students are bombarded with messages about the job's difficulties, creating a sense of fear and apprehension before they even enter the workforce.
  • Selection Process Gaps: The current emphasis on academic achievement in veterinary school admissions often overlooks essential qualities like emotional intelligence and resilience. This results in graduates who may excel technically but struggle with the emotional and interpersonal demands of the job, increasing their vulnerability to burnout and compassion fatigue.

VetLove Tenacity Score: A Unique Approach to Building Resilience

The episode presents a unique approach to resilience training developed by VetLove, Dr Geoff's group of practices. Their "Set for Vet" program utilises a series of challenging physical activities to assess and cultivate resilience in new graduates. The "tenacity score is derived from these activities, which include:
  • Brick-holding deep squat
  • Weighted uphill sprint
  • Ice bath endurance
These challenges push participants to their physical and mental limits, revealing their baseline resilience and capacity for growth. While unconventional, this approach reflects a belief that physical toughness translates to mental fortitude, preparing graduates for the emotional rigours of veterinary practice.

The 3 Ps of Resilience: Passion, Purpose, and Persistence

The episode emphasize three key pillars of resilience development:
  • Passion: Amplifying the inherent passion for animal care that drives most veterinary professionals. This involves fostering a love for the profession despite its challenges and celebrating the positive aspects of the job.
  • Purpose: Cultivating a strong sense of purpose by connecting with the "why" behind the work. This means understanding the profound impact veterinary professionals have on animal lives and families, reinforcing the value and significance of their role.
  • Persistence: Developing the ability to bounce back from setbacks, viewing challenges as opportunities for growth. This involves embracing a "never give up" attitude, knowing that tough days are inevitable, but the ability to rise above them is what defines true resilience.

Finding the Balance: Avoiding Toxic Resilience

While promoting resilience, the episode also cautions against the dangers of "toxic resilience". This concept refers to the detrimental effects of pushing oneself beyond healthy limits, ignoring warning signs of burnout, and perpetuating a "just keep going" mentality without allowing for rest and recovery.
The episode advocates for a balanced approach, recognising that true resilience involves:
  • Self-Awareness: Learning to recognise personal limits and warning signs of burnout.
  • Vulnerability: Being able to express struggles and seek support when needed.
  • Prioritizing Well-being: Making time for self-care, rest, and activities that foster mental and emotional health.

Key Takeaways: Building a More Resilient Veterinary Profession

  • Shift the Narrative: Challenge the negative messaging surrounding the profession by highlighting its positive aspects and the incredible impact veterinary professionals have.
  • Prioritize Holistic Selection: Advocate for veterinary school admission processes that consider emotional intelligence, communication skills, and resilience alongside academic achievements.
  • Invest in Resilience Training: Support the development and implementation of resilience training programs that equip new graduates with the tools to navigate the challenges of the profession.
  • Foster Supportive Environments: Cultivate a culture of open communication, vulnerability, and support within veterinary practices, creating safe spaces for individuals to express their struggles and seek help when needed.
  • Promote a Balanced Approach: Encourage a healthy approach to resilience, acknowledging the importance of self-care, rest, and recognising personal limits while fostering a strong sense of purpose and passion for the profession.
By addressing the systemic issues that contribute to burnout and promoting a culture that values both technical expertise and emotional well-being, the veterinary profession can build a more resilient workforce capable of thriving amidst the inherent challenges of this rewarding but demanding field.

Combating Negativity and Burnout in the Veterinary Industry

The veterinary profession, while deeply rewarding, is grappling with pervasive negativity and alarming rates of burnout. The episode paints a stark picture of the challenges, highlighting the emotional toll and the need for a cultural shift to protect the well-being of veterinary professionals.
Here are key strategies to combat negativity and burnout, drawing on the sources and our conversation:

1. Shift the Narrative: Vet is Life!

The episode passionately advocate for replacing the prevailing negativity with a message of hope and positivity: "Vet is Life!". This involves:
  • Celebrating the Positives: Actively highlighting the rewarding aspects of veterinary work, focusing on the impact made on animal lives, the human-animal bond, and the privilege of making a tangible difference.
  • Challenging Negative Voices: Confronting negativity head-on, whether it comes from educators, colleagues, or even oneself. Refusing to let cynicism and pessimism dominate the conversation is crucial.
  • Sharing Success Stories: Amplifying stories of resilience, passion, and fulfilling careers within the industry to inspire and encourage both current and future generations of veterinary professionals.

2. Rethink Selection: Prioritise EQ and Resilience

The episode argues that the current emphasis on academic achievement in veterinary school admissions often overlooks crucial traits like:
  • Emotional Intelligence (EQ): The ability to understand and manage emotions, both one's own and those of others. This is vital for navigating challenging client interactions and building strong team relationships.
  • Resilience: The capacity to bounce back from setbacks, cope with stress, and maintain well-being in demanding environments.
Implementing a more holistic selection process could involve:
  • Personality Assessments: Incorporating questionnaires or interviews that assess personality traits and identify individuals with strong EQ and resilience.
  • Evaluating Life Experiences: Considering applicants' involvement in activities that demonstrate teamwork, leadership, and the ability to handle pressure.

3. Invest in Resilience Training: Equip Graduates to Thrive

The episode strongly advocate for integrating resilience training into veterinary education and professional development. This could involve:
  • Workshops and Programs: Providing practical skills and strategies for managing stress, building emotional resilience, and developing effective coping mechanisms.
  • Mentorship and Support Networks: Connecting new graduates with experienced professionals who can provide guidance, encouragement, and a safe space to discuss challenges.
  • Promoting Self-Care: Educating veterinary professionals about the importance of prioritising their well-being through activities like mindfulness, exercise, and maintaining a healthy work-life balance.

4. Foster Supportive Cultures: Build Strong Teams

Creating positive and supportive work environments is crucial for combating burnout and fostering resilience. This involves:
  • Open Communication: Encouraging open dialogue about challenges and struggles, creating a safe space for vulnerability without fear of judgment.
  • Teamwork and Collaboration: Building strong team dynamics where colleagues support and encourage one another, fostering a sense of belonging and shared purpose.
  • Recognizing and Addressing Burnout: Providing resources and support for individuals experiencing burnout, intervening early to prevent escalation and promote recovery.

5. Lead by Example: Be the Change You Want to See

Veterinary leaders and educators play a critical role in combating negativity and fostering resilience. They must:
  • Embrace the "Vet is Life!" message: Actively promote positivity and celebrate the profession's impact.
  • Model healthy behaviours: Prioritise their own well-being and demonstrate effective coping strategies.
  • Create supportive environments: Foster open communication, teamwork, and a culture that values resilience.
  • Advocate for change: Push for systemic changes in education and training to address the root causes of burnout.
By shifting the narrative, prioritising resilience, and fostering supportive cultures, the veterinary industry can create a brighter future for its professionals and ensure the continued well-being of those who dedicate their lives to caring for animals.
Resilience is such a loaded word.I'll give you an example from outside of it to explain why I say this.My kids, like all parents, I want them to be resilient humans.I want them to be able to face adversity with their chins up to not shy away from hard things.
But I also want them to be self aware enough to be kind to others and to themselves when they need to be.Not too hard on themselves, but not too easy.Goldilocks level, They play rugby.My kids, they've played it from a very young age, back from when there was all about fun and inclusivity with nobody keeping score.
Well, nobody except for all of the kids.To where my eldest is now, where things are starting to get a bit more serious.That eldest has a new coach, he's phenomenal.Ex Wallaby player, super experienced coach.I love watching him, Coach.
Last week at training, after a bunch of kids had come off the field nursing bumps and bruises, sometimes with some tears, Coach gave a bit of a talk after training.There's a difference between hurt and injured, he said.We want to avoid injury, but hurt?
That's part of the game.In fact, if you finish a game and you're not hurting, you probably didn't play hard enough.Now, I know that some of you might think so much toxic masculinity.Maybe I think about that too.
Like, where is the line between suck it up and power through and put aside how you're feeling and being sensibly resilient.And that's why I say resilience is such a loaded word.The boomers think that the millennials are not resilient enough, and the millennials look at the boomers and think, I'm not putting up with that shit.
And us Gen.XS are somewhere in the middle trying to keep the peace.I'll tell you this about the rugby, though.In eight years of watching junior rugby, I've never seen a single coach tell a kid to toughen up, man up or even to stop crying.There's always concern how you're feeling.
Can you walk?Can you bend it?No, no, no, don't bend it that way.There's a hug if it's needed, or a bag of ice, a lolly.And then usually it's have a rest and when you feel ready, then get back out there and give him hell because your team needs you.
So back to coach Ben and hurt versus injured, he said to the team, this is what we train you for, to make your bodies resilient enough so that you can put up with the hurt without getting injured.What he doesn't say explicitly is that we're also building emotional resilience, not toughness, because tough is tough until it breaks.
But resilience.Resilience bounces back, and they'll need that because Hard Knocks are baked into the game.Rugby is a blood sport, after all.And according to Jeff Wilson, our guest for this episode, something else that is a blood sport is veterinary science.
And Jeff Jeff is intimately familiar with resilience veterinarian, down to the core doctor.Jeff Wilson lives a vast and varied life, split between being a family man, veterinarian, practice owner and adventurer, and not a let's take the four by four out to the beach this weekend and rough it on a blow up mattress.
While the beers chill in the esky type of adventurer, much more of a polar explorer world record breaker kite surf across an ocean type of adventurer in the spirit of Shackleton and Scott.Highlights of Jeff's expeditionist career include the longest solo unsupported polar journey in human history, the fastest unsupported crossing of Greenland, the fastest solo unsupported crossing of Antarctica, the first across the Torres Strait by Kiteboard, the first and only wind assisted crossing of the Sahara Desert, and the first wind powered crossing of the Simpson Desert in Australia.
Jeff's newest adventure, Project 0, is a Net Zero Docu series documenting A voyage that explores some of the world's most isolated and vulnerable environments and a visible impact of global warming on those landscapes, and engaging with the world's leading climate scientists, advocates, and initiatives.
But where Jeff shows true courage and true resilience is when he's back in Australia facing anal glands and itchy dogs and fluted cats and upset clients and round two of a growing veterinary team with his new group of vet practices, vet Love.
In this conversation, Jeff takes us on a journey through the peaks and troughs of his own experiences, shedding light on the dangers of pushing ourselves too far and the pitfalls of toxic resilience versus utilizing passion, purpose, and persistence to help shape true resilience.
Jeff helps us to explore where things like vulnerability, optimism, and a service mindset fits in with toughness.And he opens up about a unique program at Vet Love designed to cultivate unicorns, exceptional vets who thrive under the weight of to mining expectations, plus trying to find that delicate balance of nurturing growth without breaking spirits.
Now before we set sail with Jeff, I just wanted to share some news about our clinical podcasts.We get a lot of questions about CPD points.Can I claim points for listening to clinical podcasts?Yes you can.In most places, most States and countries will allow unstructured or unassessed CE points for podcast listening.
So just write down here much you listen.That used to be my answer, but now, as of about a month or so ago, the answer is absolutely yes.Assess points, even in the US, because we have race approval for a bunch of our episodes and we're working on the rest.
So now you can listen at your leisure on your way to work or while you're trying to drown out the noise of kids.And then later you can go to the space where we keep our show notes, click a link that will take you to your quiz, pass the quiz, the answers are all in the show notes, and get an official race approved CE certificate emailed to you as a record of how smart you're becoming.
It's that simple.Join our community of vet vault nerds at vvn.supercast.com or e-mail us at info@thevetvault.com to find out about our practice subscriptions.Oh, and then one more last little technical thing about this episode and audio quality.
I managed to catch Jeff for this interview somewhere between the South Pole and his next console, so we are recording this with Jeff literally in the vet clinic.I don't know if you know this, but vet clinics do not have the best audio acoustics and there's a fair bit of background noise.So when you listen to this, you'll notice for the 1st 9 minutes or so of the conversation.
I put up with Jeff's really bad acoustics and then I politely asked him to move to a better room.So at about 9 minutes the sound gets heaps better.I kept the 1st 9 minutes in there because the content is just so good.So I apologize for less than perfect audio, but you can hear what he says and you have to hear it.
OK, let's get started with Doctor Jeff Wilson.So excited for this chat.It's so good to be here.It's been a long time coming.
I know I did some prep for you and Googled you and that's your life is a big rabbit hole.Like, you could spend ages reading about what Jeff's been up to, but I think I've got a good one.We'll start at the normal first question.Bad decisions lead to good stories.Do you agree?
And if you do, do you have any stories that support that statement?And I think you probably would have a lot of bad decision good stories.Oh yeah.I mean, obviously as we get older, we're trying to make less bad decisions because in the wilderness seal, bad decisions can lead to you not coming home or weak time in a bag.
On this last year I think the bad decision was trying to sail the Southern Ocean in a tiny little seal style bike with Stanley on board.You know we had a moment there in the Southern Ocean thousand or where it's from the nearest ship that we've held a the ocean just went crazy.
Sorry to knock to the mounting wind 15, Mint Seas, 3 different 12 or engines on top of each other and this kid thrown around like a core and all four of us dressed and are ready for the bike break up and us into the live route and you're just thinking, what the hell, why did I decide to do that?
But yeah, and certainly a good story, but I'm trying to minimize the good stories in the last quarter of my life.Good stories, but stories that don't involve near death experiences.Absolutely.And drinking story or something less less the matter?Jeddre, if we had recorded this podcast before you end on that trip and you said to me I'm going to sail the South Seas on a small little boat, I think I would have told you, Jeff, that sounds like a bad decision, right?
Absolutely.I mean and in front of your boat feels big until you get into a real estate and then you feel, you feel like an Ant amongst giant.It's it's very humbling.Yeah.So you said a question there when you told that story, You said when you were caught in the middle of all of that, you thought to yourself, why am I doing this?
And I want to start the front end of this whole conversation with why do you do all the stuff that you do?Yeah, I mean, it's kind of funny because, I mean, I think a lot of people feel for my poor like Sarah, she's been a very pleasing girl.But.And I think if this had been a midlife crisis and I've suddenly gone crazy and become a polar explorer on top of you know being a vent resurgent, you kind of Felix sorry for her because that that's you know some sort of reality to something.
You know a lot missed flights.But it's something that I've done really on my Chris had been so I can remember sort of the age of five.You know when I met Sarah I was disappearing a Little Miss very regularly.Even when we were dating and then early marriage there was a period obviously knocking down and and letting the bat try and then building our first practice group, young kids on the ground.
You know all of that sort of periods of dad where you're not bringing it frequently but it's always been part of my DNA.So you know my family feel like I was 4 and 100 years too late.I were being in the heroic age or shack over and Morrison Scott type personality and I really do relate for those men and the challenges they had assimilating it to noble society but I really love the balance I've got now.
It's taking a long time but I can get the balance between passionate band work bringing their Polaris Bible to resilience about and start bouncing into that resign.For a long time we built firewall between the two because I really excel they didn't help each other but with the talented was the young vets field today and young people feel today the resilience development stuff that we use in fields oh the clicking ball.
So for the first time I feel like it's hand in glance and this odd lifestyle is starting to work.But it's taken 53 years to get that me.So you say that you you're using the polar or the adventuring, springing it into vent work.
Is that through resilient training or how are you fitting the two together?Well Mel playing trainer, My managing director is a super tenant lady and before the last polar journey, which is 2019-2020 CK Green citizen, why do you not talk to Arquibor about all the stuff that you're sharing with corporates in terms of resides development dream big plan.
Well, finding passion in what you're doing, all of that stuff.So you never talk to our people.And I kind of said, well it's a bit like a prophet.It's not a prophet in his hometown.You you're just Jeff Wilson, you know you're you're probably not going to be taken seriously by the people that you work with.
They've seen you doing an anal bland and and getting Martin Lutg on your face.So they don't see you as its polar explorer.Where if we're not stepping in front of a bunch of accounts in Sydney or you know corporate gig Pert in the mining community they see you as this incredible Gregor Bowler explorer and you have authority to talk about Razine.
It's because of the survival situations and push brewery.But Mounds said Listen, I think you know the time was now and then when I got back from that to then he would step within a month into COVID.And during that COVID era I started to to talk to our own people about Brazilian development, about D&D.
How do we remain passionate and enjoyable during 30 years into the veterinary career And we started here massive shit in teens and all stabbed and rotation rates and that was through the genius of Mao.Just don't hate you have to bring the stuff back and me being raving up what they to be open and vulnerable in front of people that I work with daily, that's always it's easier to be open and vulnerable.
They're really not going to see again But when you're working with them daily and you're healing off your lives and and exciting your heart and your creators your wants, that's more difficult with your own people.But it isn't an amazing act to a point you know to be running program for say for bad.
It's just for graduates coming straight out of uni.They join the bad luck set or bad program and the pool boxes that pour through 24 hour sailing, they put through climbing through 40 megabit tunnels, their foot through I stars.
It put through breath holding free diving.All of this horrendous start the jet, stop reading that tap out point because they my goal is to have a graduate.The Tampa order is so far out of our consulting room.It's so far out of the surgery that and when they have a fat witch they bleed into death on the table.
They're not going into panic and their brain they shutting down.They're not going back into that reptilian brain because they dangled off a rope in a terrifying spider filled black hole at Mount France.You know connected to me in there and I'm teaching them how to feed through pattern, how to breathe properly and can't be stand to a point where when that space is going horribly wrong, they're just thinking clearly.
I got this, I got confidence.It's amazing that see it start to really affect these young ones to a point where our resilience program last year, it started with six and we've got three of that sets that I would say a Unicorn set.
They're best that are going to be exceptional at what they do and do it for a lifetime because they're they're loving it, they're passionate.Their KPIs were all charred or they're communicating well, they're fearless, and I really do think it's a result of bringing this stuff into the BET world.
What you discussed there, what you do with your team?I've got a couple of questions and it's just I didn't plan on discussing this at all, but immediately, are you getting buy in from that guy, the team saying, wow, this is awesome, let's do this, yeah.It's tricky because it's almost like they feel like these new grads of the sport kids on the block because they've not had this level of attention.
You know, we've talked about resilience development, but we've never done it in practicality.But the cost of the program is pretty hefty for us and put all of the staff through, you know overnight sailing a 24 hour high, we we've developed a thing called the bat Love Tenacity score which these poor buggers have to hold the brick outstretched into a deep squat to failure.
And then they Sprint out my driveway which is this horrible cement driveway with the numbers.Every crack is numbered and at the beginning of the program we see their tap out point bottom 3rd and then they're into an ice bar for as long as they can handle it.
When we aggregate those scores they get a better up tenacity score and that's an aggregate of a squat and sprink up a hill with a brick and then an ice bar and working with them for six months and we retest that and usually we have to pull them out of the ice bar before they get hydrothermia.
So the.Reason I ask is how do you structure this?Because it's such a cool idea.And I find that when you talk to veterinary leaders that often are very good ideas that people come up with.But getting the team to say yes to it, and sometimes, I mean the stuff you're describing, I can see the benefit.
But it's not like, hey, let's go to the movies or let's go to the pub.They're hard things.How do you get that?Is it part of the requirement that if you work for Red Love, you're going to have to go through the tenacity thing?Or is it a voluntary thing?But no.It's a voluntary thing to get into the program and we we do pay them a bonus during 5th year.
So the young ones who sign up, the idea is most of our grads arrive exhausted.They've been working in job, studying their just on exams.They come in and they're set for failure because they're tired, they're stressed, they're going to make a mistake and that's going to affect confidence.
So we listen, here's a 10 grand bonus, go and relax, have a holiday, we'll see you the 1st of February, but we're going to go hard.So they have the whole of January, December, January off.They should come in ready to party.The issue we have is because it's a tenacity development program, you'd think it would attract the very best of the graduates because of the bias.
But they look at the bias and don't believe it.They're like, this is too good to be true.What am I?Oh.Oh baby.It's like, well, how shit is this job that they have to give me 10,000 bucks just?Yeah, I know.I'm like, I'm distracting my head guy.Holy crap, they don't.But they either don't believe it or they think it's some sort of catch.
So maybe we need to reduce it to $1000 bonus.But once they end, I think they realize we've got myself on surgical sort of mentorship.Chris Luzowski surgical mentorship.Ash Henneker on medical coaching career, Judes on medical coaching.
We have a communication specialist come and talk to them here.We're tackling it from all areas.But then the three big things that the three big fears that we're finding is 1.They're told all the way through uni that the job's going to suck from the freaking podium.Like I'm furious at the academics because we spent 50 years training the wrong people.
We're picking that top 1% who are on the spectrum, generally with very low EQ for a blood sport.So we're training the wrong effing people and then they tell them the job's going to suck.You're going to sell harm, you're not going to earn money, you're going to work 100 hour a week and get exhausted.
And they're all lies.So we we can show them if they value their time and bill properly 38 hour week, we can get you to a triple figure income very quickly and then if we can give you equity dividends you know we can times out by three.
So you'll be doing as well as the dentists doing something that you love making a difference.You're not looking in the same office for your whole career.It just drives me crazy that we're fighting this thing where we we just brought our last our next group of 6 graduates in two weeks ago.
And I got on the podium in front of them and just said, hey, this is a really intimate group.This is what we're trying to do.You're working the best job in the world.I can teach you how to communicate well, how to eat well, sleep well, balance your life.You've got to have interests outside veterinary science.
Do not come to veterinary science for happiness.This is not what veterinary science is for.You're a servant.It's a service industry.You're here to serve.You come in with a service attitude and understand that you're here to take pain away from animals that cannot speak for themselves.
If you've got that attitude, then you are going to be passionate and you'll be as fired up as me for this job in 34 years.When they came out of that session, there was a full day.The poor buggers were thrown into ice baths that, you know, it's a really awkward, uncomfortable day for them.
At the end of it, they weren't shocked.And I said, hey, how was that?And I said, you know, that's the first time we've ever heard anyone speak lying.Over this industry and I'm like my whole mantra for this year, vet is lie.It is it.
We have to speak positive about our industry.The drug reps come in dragging their feet.Our team leaders are dragging their feet.You talk to the reps and let's say three out of four clinics they go into, we'll have a lead VAT narrowing who's you know down in the dumps about the industry.
And we've got young vets coming out fearful of the job they're stepping into because for five years, a uni, they've been told from the podium that the industry sucks.So we have done this to ourselves by a allowing the academics to pick intelligence, not EQ and mental toughness.
None of these kids would survive uptaking to the paramedic field.We need to apply the same metrics that they're using.You know that the kids that have done other things in their life or played football or done team sports make incredible veterinarian.
The ones that have struggled to get the score and had their second course, they're the ones we picked for the resilience program.Six out of six of the kids in the resilience program have done another course before they get into that.So I know that they want this.They're hungry for.They're going to be brand.
You know, I know I'm rambling a little bit here, but my key passion is if we can pick the right people and tell them that is life, don't tell them that is there, Yeah, Then we create incredible veterinarians that stay in the industry.And you and I are working harder than we thought we would at this age because we've lost so many good bats that they've either been aligned with a vet that's negative or they've had someone speak poison over it and it's killed their passion and they've left.
Wow, you've opened up so many doors for conversations, Jeff.Firstly, I just want to ask quickly so we're the picking of the wrong people.And I've heard that said before, So what?What do the paramedics do?What metrics do they apply for selection?I've never heard of that before.We need I think if you look at the intelligent pyramid, we're picking top 1% and the other school I know of that is actually doing a very simple questionnaire to try and pick the mid band is Wagga Wagga.
I might have the stats wrong, but I think drop their two year drop out rate from 50% to 10% by doing 30 questions and all that's trying to do is identify that mid band.It's easy for the universities to go, OK, let's just make it an intelligence bar.
Everybody wants to do that.But what we're doing is picking the kids that have not had time to go and learn communication skills, develop emotional intelligence.You know, we're picking the ones that have had terrible experiences in life.So they're damaged and they turn the animals.
So they hate people and and we're trying to get them to deal with five people per animal.So, you know, just picking those people that are emotionally traumatized from some events in their life and they're driven animals because they hate people, that's the wrong person for a veterinarian like we need, we need people that that have that free fold love.
They love the animal, they love the client, they love their team.You know, when we get those in a team, then there's no problem with passion, there's no problem with positivity.Problem is, we're trying to have heard this damaged flock and get them to understand that, hey, I know people are annoying, but there's five people for every animal.
You need to learn how to deal with them.And if we're communicating well, the financial discussion doesn't even come up because you've communicated how valuable that animal is to the family unit.And it's worth 1600 bucks for dental or whatever it is that we're struggling.That when you've got someone who is on the spectrum somewhere, they're really struggling to communicate.
Everything's stressful, They love bits of the job because they're good at it, but the things that cause stress start pushing them out of industry.And if we can select from that intelligence pyramid, we don't need geniuses.You know what we're doing as vets, I think we like to think we're geniuses but mid band with high EQ is way more valuable.
And then we don't have that skills gap with somebody who's quality intelligent but can't get a capture in OR highly intelligent and finds the fact which by the most stressful thing in their life or an animal dies on their watch and they take it so personally that they want to go home and self harm.
That's not on them, that's on us.And the educators picking the wrong person, you know the paramedic kind of psycho valve.Just applying that to what we're doing on the intake would fix a lot of our problems industry wide.
So even the resilience program that we're doing, it's a little too late.You know, once you've committed five years, you lie and then you realize this is different to what I expected.There's a lot more people involved, there's a lot more finance and communication required.
I'm not a good communicator.I don't like people.You know.No matter of how much resilience I can teach that person.It's still going to be stressful for them dealing with the general public and most of the self harm I've seen along the way.And touchwood.
We've never had anyone within the vet.Vet love.Teen self harm has come from trauma.Pre vet school.They carried that with them thinking that veterinary science would make them happy.And I recently had a young graduate come home for dinner.
And her comment was.I really hope veterinary science makes me happy.And and I got so passionate and blown up about it that Sarah had to put a hand on my arm and go.Hey, give the poor girl a break.I'm like victory.Science is not here to fucking make you happy.It is not here to make you happy.
You're a servant.You are coming in with the wrong attitude.And if you come in looking for happiness with inventory science you go last five mirror.You have to see your role as the maker of magic.You're here to reduce pain, to bring health to work with the family unit.
Make sure that animal is treated fairly.You know when you come at it from service mindset, you hear the serve, serve, serve, then you find happiness through it.But if you're coming here to get happiness then you're in the wrong trade and getting that understanding.
It's too late.When they've done five years to hear that, they need to hear it pre intake, first year, second year, starting to get them into a service mindset before they get out and and the.Reality of what you're describing there, of what the job involves of it is it's a give.
It's a it is a giving job.And it is hard because I I feel sometimes like we and I think I'll probably put myself for the 1st 5 to 10 years in that group of going.Why is this job not make this job freaking hard?When is it going to get easier And it's taken a long time to realize no, it doesn't actually like some of the technical stuff gets easier, but a lot of it is still hard.
But hard doesn't mean bad.Necessarily no.And I.Think understanding.You know when I'm talking to a room of veterinarians and describing the hardship of surviving a polar storm where your solo you're in a tent and you're getting decreasingly optimistic forecast from your weather?
Guys like this is a savage storm coming, muckling.Build a wall, It's going to be 3 or 4 days of hell for you.And then the next forecast, 12 hours later, is it's downgraded.You've now got a polar hurricane crossing the Antarctic Ocean.It's going to slam in your position within six hours.
This may not be a survivable event.And then you're forced to make the phone call home and say, listen, Sarah, this is a really bad situation.I may not be able to communicate during the worst of the storm.If the tent fails, my survival time is going to be less than four hours.
Yeah.You're describing all of that and then referencing back, You know, having survived that sort of storm, you'd think that the veterinary world would have nothing to challenge you.But a day where you've got back-to-back surgeries, you've got consults in the morning, you know, a couple of staff issues to sort out.
There's a bit of political dynamics within the hospital and then you go out and you're 3 consults behind in the afternoon session.Those sort of days can be equally it's tough.So for vets to hear that and go, OK, you've got this polar explorer saying, you know these are really tough things but the vendor environment will throw similar kind of stress load on the human frame.
It just allows you to go, hey, it's absolutely fine to have days where you feel a bit pushed, but it's how you respond to that that matters.You know, do you, do you get stressed and start getting the knives out and stabbing your team or or do you go out the back and practice what we taught you in the ice bar?
You go and box breed, you get your pulse rate down and maybe decrease the load?Say, listen, I'm going to let these people know to go and get a coffee and come back or I'm going to admit an animal.Let's try and reduce some load before we blow a gasket, recognizing when your system is at a pressure point and that being OK.
Like, it's absolutely fine to say, hey, I'm a little cooked here, but we tend to feel like we've got to keep this stiff upper lip and that can be our own undoing.So I think we're recognizing that the battery environment is tough, but it's the best job in the world.It absolutely is.
We've got to believe that as leaders.I look at, you know, I spoke to her vet yesterday who used to work for us and she had quite a lot of mentor instability and we recognized that that was getting worse over time.So she self elected herself out when worked elsewhere, probably a less nurturing environment and just over a week ago she tried to ID and killer skull.
That's really topical for me understanding OK, what is it?All of that stuff that she's going through didn't come from veterinary science.That came from pre.It pre dates the veterinary course.She's a brilliant veterinarian.
There's a bit like almost like body dysmorphia where you've got someone who is prime white, but they see themselves as either white or underweight and everyone's saying, hey, you're prime, wait, you're fine, you're doing well.I think what happens with a lot of these younger vets is that they see themselves as being inept or unable to cope, and everyone around them is looking at them going, hey, you're doing a great job, your clients love you, the animal outcomes, you're getting a superb how do we get you to believe in yourself?
And in this particular vet's case, it's just not possible for her to see how good she is.She'd be one of the best vets I've ever worked with, and yet she's trying to end a lot.And he just OK.You probably were the wrong personality type for this blood sport, you know, on any given day, we've got shit pissing, blood flowing around the room and things dying, and a lot of passion.
You've got to love the fight like you've got to love being in there.It's it's a phenomenal quote.You'd know the quote, You know, give me an hour in the arena with blood, sweat, mud all over me.I'd rather an hour of that in the lifetime of the ordinary.You know, you've really got to love that fight.
I think that's what we're getting across to.These young ones going, hey, nothing's perfect.Absolutely.There's no job on the planet that's perfect.But if we can see the gold in the Rock.You know you're looking at this rock face of Henry Sides and just looking for the seams of gold.That crucially, if you've fixed and the dogs in the park running madly 3 months later or litter kittens that you've brought into the world or if you're a larger practice with this foal running around that you were involved in bringing into the world, you've got to see those bits of gold.
And that undoes all of the fatigue and the long days.But also in with that teaching them ways to recognize stress.Recognize when, you know I call a a real high producing vets, Maseratis, we, they run at really high ramps and we have to put them on the blocks, let them cool down for a while and then put them back in again.
Yeah, we've got some diesel chug chugs like me who are not going to create brilliance in medically, but I can fix just about anything and if I don't know what to do, I'll find someone smarter like you.You talk to you.No, no.My That is literally my superpower.
I just know lots of smart people.Another diesel Chug Chug.So we're never going to blow up, but you need that mix in the team.But recognizing that it's OK to go, hey, I really think you're in danger of blowing up.Let's get you off the front line for a little bit of that human dynamic making it OK to be vulnerable.
You know, we changed a lot of the way that we communicate from Expedition now on the back of Brenda a Brown stuff on vulnerability.I don't know if you've read any of that, but there'll be people listening here Very familiar with Brenda A Brown's work on vulnerable language and that works twofold 1 in consult room to create bond with clients very quickly.
Being a little vulnerable isn't pure gold, but from Expedition it used to be that I would ring back to home base to check in.Hey, I've made this amount of miles today.This is my position.Code green, everything going forward I'm fine.Whereas in the tent I was decompensating and wondering why I was there, you know, had aches and strains that were making me feel like I wasn't going to get to the objective with sand.
On the last, the longest journey, we really worked on me being open and vulnerable from day one.And for the 1st 17 days I was in tears in the tent every night just weeping to Sarah and back home she's thinking like, what the hell is wrong with this guy?
He's not even going to make it to the parliament accessibility.But it was when I got home and looked at the wind chill chart.I was operating in -88 to -92 below 0 Celsius wind chill.So air temperatures of -40 to -50 but going upwind in 25 to 30 knots.
So, so a little bit of.Crying is totally acceptable, yeah.When you see that, you're like, I feel a bit better about crying.And the minute we got to the pole of inaccessibility I was cross wing downwind and everything changes.So really getting across our bets that it's not always going to be upwind there.
It might be tough now, but you'll develop better skills, you'll learn to communicate better, you'll develop a bit of resilience, a bit of hardiness.If it feels really challenging now, that doesn't mean that you're not going to make an exceptional then there, and it doesn't mean that you're not going to keep your passion for it.
Understanding that that if a human body can deal with 17 days straight in excruciating conditions, as long as you've been vulnerable and offloading that little bit at the end of the day you've got a network around you of healthy support, there's nothing that you can't work your way through.
And I think this is the exciting thing about bringing the polar stuff into the veterinary game.It really has given us a lot of help dealing with the current the crisis of the modern day Venry era.I wanted to give you a quick update on our specialist support space.
If you haven't come across it before, We go ahead at a space where you can interact with a group of specialists to give you case support on those tricky case conundrums that you face in everyday practice.The space is housed on the same app where our subscribers get their show notes, which is a super nifty tool where you can upload photos or videos or even chat live to the specialist if the case requires it.
The idea with this is that you have a direct guilt free line of communication with somebody who can help you out with those cases that you can't refer or you don't want to refer, but you just need a little bit of extra brain power to help you make decisions or take your thinking.We started off the space with the support in medicine and emergency and critical care and in the last month we added support in dermatology, veterinary oncology as well as support specifically for those tricky diabetic cases.
Our subscribers will have listened to the episode with Doctor Linda Fleeman on using basal insulin in your patients for a complete paradigm shift in how you manage your diabetic patients.But this has led to a lot of questions for Doctor Linda, so we decided to get her on the space so she can answer your questions directly.
It is a paid space, but we've kept it as affordable as possible at about $15.00 a month.We can ask as many questions as you want and expect a same day turn around time.We've put the link for the space in the show description wherever you're listening to this.So if you feel like you can use a little bit of extra help, go and check it out today.
I want to come back to how that's the uptake on that and whether it's working, But just a couple of things I want to circle back to.It's so interesting that you compare that low that you're having in the 10th at night, having to call home and say, look, I might not survive the storm.
I can't imagine anything harder than that.But that you acknowledge that a bad that a vet clinic is also bad.Like it's it's not 'cause I coming into this conversation, I was half expecting that you'd be like, well, I've survived all this other stuff and I can run through a desert and I can do all these crazy things.
So, Dad, the vet clinic is nothing like it's the zero stress.It's easy, but I love that you say no, it is.It is still hard.I have another friend who was on the podcast once, Doctor Gareth Steele, who is a he's a vet but then he actually is a military man as well, to the point of where he actually did active service in Afghanistan and all that sort of stuff.
He told me once he said that working in a non supportive vet clinic in a in a in the wrong kind of environment is harder for him than being an active duty and being shot dead in a war zone.Mentally it's harder because he's he's not getting the support and he's finds it more stressful at times.
He's at least when he's being shot at, he has a team that know exactly what to do.They support.There's there's a structure that makes that achievable, which I found totally fascinating, I think.It's hard too, because if you're a vet out there listening and you're in that horrible stage where you're the only guy.
And we looked at three Clinic last week for acquisition and they were all the same.It was a an older guy or girl who weren't say 40 years in their clinic.They've struggled to find associate are they one vet doing a $2,000,000 turnover which is we all know to do that you're working 100 hour a week, you're running ragged.
So and then they got to the end of their handle with it and put the practice on the market.But we look at it and go we can't sustain that profitability with the modern vet.They're going to work a 38 hour week.So we need to put 3 vets in to do the work that you've been doing, 1 that's going to ham at the bottom line and we can't acquire the practice.
So you know, for that person, they're feeling completely isolated, They can't find an associate, They don't have the management skills to work out an exit strategy other than I'm just don't put it on the market, I'm done.And it I just got sad looking at the figures because you can kind of see the human pain behind it.
And I don't really have a solution for that.But all I can do is deal on our little corner of the pond and Glenn Richardson is a good mate of mine.And years ago when we were trying to get a bond, uni, veterinary course up, my theory was listen, the educators aren't listening to us.
I can't even get I send emails to every single year say let me talk to you first and second years about passion, purpose, persistence, the three tenets of Brazilian development early.Let me tell them what a phenol or job this is and if anybody talks to you from the podium about.
How crap it is on the F off.We need to get them out of the agitators.They need to be gone.If you do not like battery science, what the freak are you teaching our kids for?That's how militant we need to be.And the only way I could see that happening was to go to Bond and say, listen, we need a separate course where it's all about high EQ, it's all about team sport, you know, picking people that are resumed from the get go.
Glenn came down and said, listen Jack, you're going to exhaust yourself.You can't fix the industry and nor do you need to.You just need to fix your little corner of the pond.And I went home and shared with Sarah Glenn's conversation and I was like, yeah, I do feel like I'm exhausting myself trying to fix an industry wide problem that's taken 50 years selecting the wrong people to get this way.
I can't, can't do it.So we kind of pulled out of that conversation with Bond and just said, OK, well listen, let's just do a retaliatory program internally and just try and protect our young vets so that they wake up every morning with excitement like you want them to wake up and put their boots on and go.
I'm in the best job in the world.I get to affect animals and I I work on every vet having an image across the 5 horizons behind them of all the animals that they fix during their career, whether it's one year career or a 30 year career.
There's honest, like the animals walking under the ark, walking across the horizons behind them so that they can really measure the effect they're having on families, on Australian communities.You know, we saw in COVID how important these animals became for people that were suffering or had loss.
They're that big rush of people grabbing puppies because they had time and even changing the way they work because when they when COVID was over, they didn't want to lose that time with their animals.You know, you've become more than just a vet for the family.You're almost counsellor and priest at the same time and and that does put a lot more pressure on our younger vets.
But if they approach it with that service mindset and are excited to put the boots on every day, then it then it's fun.Jet 2 vets who are sick of it, who are and as I said I've I've been there but who go.I don't know if I can do this anymore.
I I feel like a lot of the problem comes down to the interactions with clients.So they are passionate about the animals.They're like, I want to fix animals.I love it.I love that aspect.But then I get to work and I get a lot of friction from the humans around the animals and they give me a hard time because I just want to do my job well.
But people are whingy, they needy.They're complaining.They I don't know.A, two questions.Have you experienced the change in your career, Jeff, in that sense?Like are people harder work now than they were when you became a vet?And B, how do you talk to your team about that aspect of the.
Because that's the sort of hard that people and I appreciate this, there's a lot of emotion and I and I think most vets realize that there is a human skill side to it.But then what exhausts them is people who just push too hard.They're not their.Well, their perception from a lot of vets is there are clients who are, they're not part of the team.
They they're in a in an almost an antagonistic fashion.How do you respond to that?Yeah, I.Mean, I think what we've seen is, you know the animal used to be in the paddock and then it's on the veranda, then it's in the lounge, now it's in bed with people.So their demands for quality medicine and surgery have gone up.
Their demands for professional educated communication have gone up.They're watching medical shows.So, you know, before if we spoke to someone about removing a lump or showed them photos of that lump coming off, they'd vomit in the corner.They now want to be involved in the process.
So you can see that as they're being more demanding, more difficult or you can go, wow, these guys are so passionate.I get to do bad science at a high level.I get to get the toys now.I can do endoscope.I can do ultrasound.I can look at digital images from X-ray that are sensational, almost like 3D.
We couldn't afford any of that stuff if the dog or the cat wasn't in the bedroom.So you know you're looking at that as a positive.And then when you get a complaining client trying to understand, like we now have a very clear no dickhead policy.Like if we've got a client who is ADH, we protect our teams and go really sorry, your behaviors are acceptable.
You're putting me at risk of losing a good team member because of your behavior.You need to go find a vet where this is acceptable and you probably won't find one.So we'll see you in six months when you've done the rounds, got second rate care, and then you come back humble or you can be humble and go and apologize to that staff member now and save yourself a lot of leg work.
And I think it's being that militant, that behavior is not acceptable.We're not going to allow that to occur.But then recognizing that generally people who are complaining are only doing it because they perceive that you dropped the ball and it's very likely that we hand dropped the ball somewhere along the line.
We've not communicated well.The expectation was different to what we delivered and getting them to be part of the healing of that process is so powerful.That's what we had, a lady who who felt like she hadn't been treated well at a particular clinic.
I knew that clinic had some customer service issues.So I rang here and talked through and said, hey, listen, I'm not going to lie to you.I think that we did drop the ball.Can I get you involved as the secret shopper over the next three months?I'll work with that team or I just want you to go in and see how we're doing, Are we improving it?
And then I went to that team and said, listen, we have some customer service issues and you guys are passionate, but you're seeing the client says I'm annoying these guys.We have to have that threefold triangle.You have to love the animal, love the client, love your team.If we've got that, then a lot of that stress disappears, because when they're misbehaving, you see it as passion for good care.
So they understood that I I said to her and listen, this lady under actually painful, but I'm going to get her to come in as regularly as she can and just measure your customer service.So blow her socks off and over the next three months this lady's in and out like a pain to this small but she single handedly helped me get their customer service to where we wanted to be.
She felt part of the process was now a loyal client and no longer a pain in the ass.So I think it's how we see it.You have to feel that OK?Am I tired?Am I titsy?Am I overreacting to someone?Or can I just drill down and try and understand what the behaviour is that's causing this difficulty?
But there are just some of us who are not people.People and we probably should never have been trained for a people facing job.But we're too short staffed to throw all those beautiful vets on the scrappy.We have to just work out ways to communicate.
So if I have a vet who is a terrible communicator, we'll try and marry him or her with a nurse that's just a 10 out of 10 human lover animal lover communicator.And they work really well and they're constantly pulling that better side and going hey you need to soften your delivery or or I understand what you're saying but you've offended this person or they it's it's really hard and my preference obviously would be to have vets and nurses who understand that triangular love in every scenario but it's not that's not the real world.
We've got to work with the talent we have and understanding that the event that hates people might be the most incredible surgeon or they might be the most incredible credible medical person.How do we protect them from being client facing a nut so that they enjoy their role Or for those vets who do find themselves dying, I'm nearly over this.
How do we sit with them and tease out what they're good at, what they enjoy and protect them from what they don't enjoy it, You know, that's I think as a team leader that the continual channel, but that's.Awesome.I love that and and you highlight such an important point there because there is the ideal employee.
So the stuff that you talk about you know who should be selecting that.But then we are also because if if I look at when I had my own practice and I, I looked at all the leadership in the management training and stuff, a lot of it and a lot of the advice outside of entry sciences here.
Pick a players, pick a players and you won't have any problems.But then I go, well, I just have to pick somebody because there's work to be done and I can't actually be all that fussy with who I select.So I've got to make it work with the tools I have well with the with the things I have available to me and try and find a way.
So I love that approach of yours to say, well this is the ideal.I want to go back quickly to what you talked about, the selection process.So when you pick your, especially the new grants, keeping in mind the resilience stuff and the stuff you're going to do with them.I was going to say to them, but let's say with them.
Do you select on that you talked about the questionnaire that they have at Wagga about checking that you're a balanced person and not just an academic star.Is that part of your selection process or are you in the same boat of going well, I've got to take.I've got to take what I can get the.Selection process for the first year was literally, you know, do you have a pulse?
And the web deodorant, literally.And I think most of the vet leaders listening to this will relate, you know, the days of interviewing are long gone.We used to interview, you know, 10 vets for one position.
Now you you've got one vet for one position and you know, you interview them and you're like, man, you're a 5 out of 10 on all the areas.But I think I can help you.That's it.And if we look at our first intake, we had six graduates.Three I thought were going to be OK, three.
We were really worried about why I just needed it.Sounds weird, but we need to crash dead stummies to test this stuff on.And the weird thing was they did quite well on the Resilience development stuff.I remember the guy that set up the ropes course for me to climb this climb called Satan's Smokestack, which is a 40 meter Laval tunnel full of spiders.
And it's dark.It's claustrophobic.It deals with their fears of heights, fears of confined spaces, fears of spiders and snakes.And they're all in there, and all six of them were throwing themselves at that crack like salmon going up a waterfall to the point where they're bruising themselves and we're like, whoa, whoa, whoa, OK, let's get some technique here.
And so none of them gave up, but the three that got to the top were the three that survived the year.And then now what I'd call unicorns, we had 3 resign from the program and leave that science completely.
So this year for the six positions that we had, we interviewed 10 and the difference is huge like we've got I think 6 out of 6 might be unicorns this year.It's really positive to I think the program's getting a bit of a momentum.
I would love eventually for it to be industry wide available where you imagine you do a five year course and then you do a one year internship focused on resilience and that one year sets you up to be $1,000,000 a year.That you know like our our absolute Unicorn is someone who communicates well, has a love for animals, a love for team, a love for clients.
They communicate so well that they're they're billing in a 38 hour we $1,000,000 a year.They're getting paid triple figures almost immediately because they're so valuable to the practice.We can build that, but it takes a year intensive to do that.I just don't know that I've got the calories to do it.
You know if you had six is exhausting.If you had sixty it would be.You'd need another 10 polar survivalists to do it.I'd love.To dig into your program.So first of all, when you talk about all the physical things you make them do, what do the lawyers say about this?
What does your HR department say about insurance?I don't know that we got insurance for this.I'm like, I think having an African background, I realized hey, let's just do it and ask for forgiveness.But she she has dotted the IS and cross the TS.The liability side was difficult, especially when it comes to climbing on rock or putting people in ice spots who could have a heart attack or or just pushing him.
We we had him offshore last year on the bike that we used for the polar expedition sailing from the top of Morton Island in the dark.So they're up all night and they're like nobody sleeps.The whole idea is you learn how to function, make good decisions without any sleep.
Ended up having 30 knots offshore so the ocean was flat.Boats cranked up and I'm yelling over the wind going you clip on, you come off this boat, you die.And I'm just looking at these six graduates clipped onto the railing, getting wet and cold all night.And to that point, nobody had thanked us for any of the programs to that point.
And as we're coming through the heads at 3:00 in the morning at Town Port, there in my head I'm going, you know, if we get to the dock and nobody has a word of appreciation, then I'll never fold this whole program.Like, I just can't put this much calories into this and feel like it's not being appreciated.
So we pull out to the dock and all six step off on the dock and they're looking up at me as I'm racking some rope, getting the boat ready to leave for the night.And they're all six personally.And thank me.And I like, are you thankful for what you're learning in the program, or are you just thankful for being alive like that?I thought you was a mix of both.
But at that point, I was like, OK, we're getting somewhere.We've got young kids that everything's happening so fast.You know, they're swiping left, swiping right.They're following people on Instagram or whatever, their social media platform.They're jumping out of planes and wingsuiting to another plane and climbing in.
You know, life's kind of crazy.We're always getting fed into them.So when we're trying to express them and give them experiences, I think in the virtual world, they've done it all before.It's almost like the nerve endings are bad.At one point I said to Andy, our area manager, I said, man, I feel like I could be nude up here with two parrots on my shoulder playing the ukulele.
And these grads wouldn't even raise a smile.They're they're either terrified or they're emotionally dead.There's something not right.And then after that cell night, there was a shit.Everybody started to wake up.And I think it's a combination of this thing, so terrified in the industry because they've been filled with negativity for five years.
They come out almost like a dog that's been smacked around the head.It's head shy.It's looking for a fence with the industry.We'll set them up to look for the negative things.You know they as a boss, you might might speak to them a bit harshly or not be as patient nor kind as he could be.
You might have a long day and rather than day that was a long day.They're like, this is what I was warned about.They might have feelings of self doubt or self harm there which are a normal transition for anyone and they suddenly this is the industry, it's killing me.So we're we're just making them so soft and bruised when they come out that they're looking for offense from the industry and even the best boss in the world can't fight that.
So raising their, what I call their tap out point, every human being has a tap out point and we know now that that's teachable.I know my experience with it initially being teachable was when my son-in-law was dating MO then 16 year old number one girl Jade.
He did an adventure with me where we kite surf from Australia to Papua New Guinea.The first team to do that and 70 kilometers from the Papua New Guinea coast, he tapped out, said I can't do this and I could sit back to him.And I said, Simon, you you got to understand that the human brain has a tap out 30% early.
It's a safety feature.It's so that you don't exhaust yourself.It's a survival mechanism.But in this situation, you can learn how to turn that back on.Ignore the fuse and you've got plenty in the tank.You've done 310 kilometers on a cardboard.
You can do another 70.We'll get here to the beach, put you in a bike and get you home.And besides, if you want to marry my girl, you're going to get to Papua New Guinea.So anyway he then Fast forward five years.
He's my partner on the attempt to cross Greenland South and north.And the record I think was held by the Norwegian that 28 days over the next 14 days he showed the most incredible amount of grit and tenacity.
And we've smashed that record by 14 days which for Aussies to compete in the Norwegian backyard and smash records just doesn't happen without huge amount of grit.Not once during that 14 days did he ever look like tapping out and he led me in he his skills had developed to a point where he was ahead of me on the last drive at to a place called Khanna, the most northern village in the world.
And I sat there on the on the ice with all the Huskies at the end of that journey, realizing, OK, we can teach this stuff.But this kid tapped out with Inside of the End on the Taurus journey five years later.He's tougher than any polar explorer I've ever partnered with.
How do we install this in our young ones in the vet industry?And I think it's just that belief, like getting them to understand that it's absolutely fine to have tough days, but when you get knocked down, you know, stay on the mat, breathe a little bit, you're only beaten by it if you don't get back up.
And getting them to understand that life is going to knock you down.So, you know, if you're an academic, you've never really had hardship in your life to this point.It's going to be really hard in the boundary environment because it's a blood sport.So understanding that you're in a blood sport and therefore resilience is necessary.
It's kind of the gateway once you realize that and go, this is the best job in the world, but it is a blood sport, you're going to need some resilience.So getting them to understand that it's kind of step one and our intake this year reflects that.You know, we've got a team of six now for the safe of that program.
They all understand that it's a blood sport.They also all understand it's the best job in the world.But what's sad is my first opening address was the first time in their education that they've heard anyone refer to veteran science as the best job in the world.
And I'm like, that confuses me.So you've got people teaching you we hate what we do.Like, that's just madness.That that is, you know, you've you've planted a whole bunch of veggies and you're spraying in with Roundup every day complaining that no veggies are coming up.Now what the fuck?
Seriously, this is not common.So.So.Why is it the best job in the world to you?Because we had, we have this rare ability to affect the outcomes.You know, if I look at all my medical mates, they're either general practice, anything that comes in, it's generally sniffling noses and whining people.
Anything of interest, they refer off to someone else.You know, they're just the catching Mitt passing off the passes, or they specialize and then you're either looking at one body part, you're just doing knee reconstructions, you're just doing hip.It becomes super repetitive with our industry.
In any one day you can be the marketing expert, you could be the social media manager, you could be the.Oncologist.You could be the dermatologist, the radiologist.It's exciting.You know, whatever part of the industry that you'd like, if you like sting, you can start going down that rabbit hole.
If you love animal behavior, you know there's so many streams, so variable, but you have to be looking for the gold in the rock.If you're just working for the rock, which is what they're all taught to do, and you're being told about the negatives and nobody's talking about the wonderful things we do with the Vetti's life program that I really want to try and fire up this year.
That is just refocusing all of our leaders, all of our people speaking in the industry and and getting militant about it.I got so worked up talking to a pharmaceutical group last year that and the wrong way.I just you're really passionate about this boss.
And I've said, yeah, I am like we have to be relative.Like it's a whole.If you don't love it, then F all like why are you in the industry?I'm so sick of us being quiet when people are being negative and so much so in clinic.I tried last year a gong in one of the hospitals and that gong was to be run every time something cool happened.
We had stickers all over the gong.New puppy, new client, new kitten.I'm healed, my leg works.You know all these wonderful things that happen in a day-to-day practice.I was dying even down to I passed away beautifully.I always managed well.
My miracle case is going well.All of these things that we could ring the gong for.And what that's doing is just giving voice to the optimists, giving voice to the positive people in the clinic.Because we give voice to the negative people like the nurse that's grumpy and tired and and it's just spreading poison through the ulcer.
We allow her to speak but the optimists feel silent.So how do we turn up the volume on the optimist?And that's going to happen at clinic level.It's got to happen at a leadership level all the way through to the IBA, the veteran surgeons board, all of those guys need to believe that we're doing the best job on the planet.
If they don't, then what the F are we doing?Let's get you out of those roles and put someone in who can protect the next 50 years of vets coming through, because at the moment they're completely expired with nothing but poison.That is death being preached over him.
And listen, I'm a realist.I understand there are tough days, but it's not toxic positivity.It's recognizing that there are tough days.If we do the two things, focus on the gold in the rock and build resilience, then we're going to be in a much better position.
You and I won't be working so hard over the next couple of decades because you've got good people coming through that are passionate about it and believe that we're making a difference in communities.You know, it's not just the animal we're treating with, We're treating the family.You know how many times in consult, you're counseling people, you're listening to them.
I think of all my favorite clients over the years, they're the ones where we ride through the birth deaths, marriages.We think, you know, whether they're animal deaths or human deaths, You know, we had that relationship whereby we could share that in the concert room, tears in the concert room, hugging, just being open and vulnerable, being human.
And you know, that's the very best bit of what we do.I'm passionate about it, as you can tell.It's it's interesting.Because there's a contrast you say so there's a vet is life but then we said in the beginning but don't expect very science to make you happy.So I'm I'm trying to merge those two concepts because how how do you put those two side to side.
Yeah, I.Think that's a sheer thing, Attitude.Because I think for some time we've been picking people that are already unhappy, they're already unbalanced, they're already dangerously on the edge and they're looking for happiness in treating animals.
And that's just a lethal cocktail.Like we honestly, I think what's going to happen for these educators to finally understand what they're doing?They're going to kill a wealthy person's child and then that wealthy person's going to go.Hang on a minute, you pick my child who was showing signs of anxiety, self harm, substance abuse, poor sleep, depression, anxiety.
You pick that person for this blood sport, knowing full well the stats, four times the natural suicide rate.And yet you didn't give a shit enough to tell them this is the wrong industry.It's going to take one of those parents going no, this is not OK, and then taking the educators to task, but then to finally wake up and go.
I know it's easy just to make it a education bar because there's no work involved in filtering out the right people.But when you're you're essentially killing these kids by picking their own people.So what I'm saying there is don't come to vet science.Looking back and you have to come with a healthy mindset going, I'm here to CERT and every vet that I've met with a service mindset is passionate.
Years later.They're just it's a slight shift in approach, but it has a massive change.And then if we then start going, OK, well let's let's hashtag.That is live everything.You have to be that dedicated and understanding.
It's not really a job per SE like anything else.It's you know, you know what it's like you're getting your veggies and Missus Smith sees you and starts talking about a dog vaginal infection that you treated the week before in the aisle of the supermarket.No human doctor.
No dentist, no lawyer is going to get that inappropriate conversation in a supermarket.But because they're animals, people feel it's OK.So it is a lie.Vet is lie.You've just got to go.Vet is lie.Laugh it off and go missus Smith, I'll call you tomorrow.
So I think understanding that, you know, don't come to venry science looking for a cure, you have to be the cure.But then also understanding that it's a lifestyle and the more you immerse yourself in that and practice positivity, one thing we're working on this year with our teens is making sure that first thing that comes out of your mouth in the morning is positive.
So when you walk into your hospital, you look at your other nurse or your vet and go, you know what, if you're done with your eyes, they look amazing or I look just something positive.It doesn't this hospital smell incredible today rather than that.Oh man.
Got a walk in or I went back-to-back this morning.So it's that negativity coming out of your mouth bursting, just being disciplined.It's just like you're doing weights mentally.If you're thinking negative thoughts when you're walking to that hospital in the morning, you're going to have a shit day.
It just.And and it sounds a bit Pollyannaish, play the GLAAD game.But what I've learned from other resources in recent years is the that concept of neuroplasticity is that your brain takes shortcuts.It'll take the easy route, literally.
Your neurons will fire the ones that get fired most regularly.So if they're the negative ones, that's what's going to happen.And initially, when you start pushing those positive pathways, it might feel unnatural.It might feel fake.You're like, I walk in and I can smell hemorrhagic diarrhea so that I have my first negative thought.
So it takes a bit of effort to look around and go, OK, well that sucks.But what's good about this morning?Let me go look for it.And once you start identifying it, then it becomes more of a habit.Your brain goes well, what's good before it starts going well?What's the downside?Because there's always a downside.As you say, it's a blood sport.
There's something's going to be shitty about your day.Probably, yeah.You might walk in and you know it smells like hemorrhagic diarrhea and you're like, oh man, that smells badly.You smell nice.Let's get into this.You know, just looking for a positive and raising it fun.
Just go, oh man, what a start.But I think if we can make that a discipline and then what happens is it becomes cultural to be positive.So when somebody comes in with a negative attitude, they'd stand out so much, it's like a rock sticking out or in a wave crashing on the beach, like that rock wasn't there yesterday.
Where's it come from?Let let's talk about that.Why is it that you're feeling so negative today and it's changing that tie, which, you know, I feel for our drug reps because they're going into the 8910 clinics a day and you imagine if ten of them or eight of them are negative when they walk through the door.
Nobody wants to see them because they're seen as an imposition on their time.But they are the thermostat.If your drug reps are happy to come into your clinics, they're the best them and said, how you doing with the positive speech and positive mindset?Yeah, I'd like to say it's definitely a pathway that you can train your brain to do.
And the younger we do it, the better it gets it.But, you know, I think it can sound like I'm possibly positive and unaware of the talented.That's not true at all.I still find days in the BET world top.It's going OK if we do what we do continually and expect a different result.
That's crazy.We have to get Milton and we have to fight for our industry.If somebody is speaking to you and telling you how crap the industry is, you need to call them out and go.You're a team leader.Why are you speaking like that?All of these young minds are watching you.
We're not going to change this through negativity.It's a bit like the climate change crisis.I mean, my whole 3 expeditions were all exploring how we can explore carbon neutral and it can be so daunting sometimes going, wow, this is happening so fast.
You know, we were packed off the end of PR 11 glacier in Patagonia and watching this massive ice rant just falling apart in front of our eyes at a speed that's one of the fastest degrading glaciers on planet Earth.And we're watching it in real time right in front of us.
And then a few months later, I'm at Port Lochroy, the southern most British Antarctic base.I'm talking to the naturalist there and he's like, how do you say optimistic?How do you say optimistic and not feel depressed with this, the speed that it's changing.We're seeing it in Antarctic, it's so fast, emperor Penguins not able to reproduce because the ice is too thin and the eggs fall through into the water and whole colonies been wiped out.
It's terrifying what's going on there.And I said, and listen, you do not have a choice.You're a flag bearer and you need to hold the flag.You need to be optimistic.You need to charge forward and believe that mankind will find a solution for you to get shot, drop the flag and disappear.
That's not an option for you.And it's just the same in veterinary science.We've got flag bearers out there who are the optimists, who say we can change.We can provide more resilient minds.We can teach them how to be passionate and enjoy every day, teach them how to communicate well, how to build well, how to earn enough funds that you feel blessed.
I honestly feel so blessed have been involved in the veterinary industry because of the way that we can build wealth if we educate our people.We've got nurses now who are millionaires on paper because of their belief in the bad luck system and they're now the primary breadwinners in their home.
One of my nurses last week said, hey, I never believed I would be the primary breadwinner in our home.My husband's able to pull back because of what we're bringing into the house through dividends.Thank you so much.It's a no thank you because you're rewarding me for the belief in the system.
The flag bearers need to be out there being optimists.Otherwise you know the industry is in real trouble.Similar to the environment story, we have to believe that we're going to find a solution to the carbon issue quicker than we are currently because currently you know it's a very depressing scene out there.
So the two mirror each other very well.You're ability to meet people who just bury their head.The Trumpers of the world, they're like, no, there's no such thing as climate change.It's a cycle.I'm like, well, you know I'm looking at the science.
So we're as vets, we're scientists.So we understand this and we've got groups within our industry like that's the climate action that are really trying to put a spotlight on this as an industry.Our role now, aside from helping our young ones come through with a good attitude is to understand how as an industry, we can move towards being carbon neutral through a recycling solar power and planting trees every surgery within that lot now where every time we take a scalpel out of our packet, we're planting 2 trees up in Borneo.
And that's got to be industry standard like we've got, we've got to understand, yeah, we're making plastic, yeah, we're making carbon, but we can't offset it.And I know that's another whole big discussion.It.Really does tie in the whole flag bearer, the whole optimist, the passionate person that is life.
You're the flag bearer for the industry and there's a huge responsibility on you.And sometimes there's the optimist.It can feel like you're a log in the stream and the whole rest of your team is hanging on to that log and you're getting pulled into the stream.And occasionally I I say to our optimist, listen, every now and then you're gonna have to shake off like a Labrador and kick all of those people off, go recover, and then hop in the stream and they can all jump on me again.
We only need one optimist in a veterinary team as a flag bearer at the front to completely change the dynamic.So we're not so like we need everyone to be a flag bearer.That'll be chaos.You think 113?Can I briefly circle back to resilience because that is your big thing that you talk about.
It's interesting.So you say that yes, you can develop resilience.So if you have, we have people come through that maybe have been selected for the vet program that don't naturally have it, but are you fighting with your program?You can improve it.It can get better I think.You can remove the needle.
Like if you've got someone who's marshmallow material and they're going to tap out, you know they have one client, they rude to them and they're in tears and like, quit the industry.You're not going to turn them into Yoda overnight.But it's moving them to a point where they're safe.
But the tap out needs to be well past what null then real life will throw at them.There'll always be those outlined days when they feel challenged and like it's tough, but they have us to the most resilient of us.So we don't have to turn them into Teflon tough.
They just need to go from marshmallow to you know, granite and then something like that.We're definitely seeing that.But understanding that the three PS of resilient development are all teachable, If we look at the most important being passion, Absolutely.
You know, they wouldn't be here.They wouldn't have survived the five years generally if they don't have some passion for animal care.So amplifying that and get them to understand that it's a job worth doing, Follow that flag bearer.You know, yeah, you're coming out of the trench, you're getting shot at, but the flag bearer's out the front.
Get in behind slipstream.Then understanding that passion is key.You have to be passionate about what we're doing and the passion is only possible if they believe that purpose.So that you know that probably the most important P would be purpose.Why are you doing what you're doing every day?
You know people call it the why.I call it the purpose.Why are you getting out of bed?And for me, obviously my purpose comes in multi channels.Like if I look at my adventure career, it's gone from working health, how much the human body can endure solo in brutal conditions to now being more, how do we continue to dream and vision and explore, but in a way that's carbon neutral.
So that's my purpose on the adventure side.It's morph now to bringing that purpose back into the veterinary field, where the purpose is to practice veterinary science, build hospitals of excellence with happy teams.That's my purpose on the veterinary side.And then my purpose on the family side is to be the best husband I can be, the best dad I can be, to be present when I'm present, to listen.
Well, you know, so there's multiple channels.But getting these young ones to understand that you've got to have purpose.You've got to understand when you put your boots in the morning, what is it you're going to do?I'm going out there to be a voice for the voiceless.I'm going out there to diminish pain, diminish suffering, to enlarge well and to be, you know, a helpmate for these families.
If they believe that, then coupled with passion, they're unstoppable and their resilience will naturally become more Hardy without any sort of training once they get those two in line.And then the third P is just that horrible old persistence, You know, we've all been there where you just feel like you're getting knocked on the mat.
It's taking a breath, crawling back to your feet and getting them to understand that they're never beaten unless they don't get off the mat and finding some fun.And that going man, I I got punched three times a day by the veterinary game.I had a plating that I did snap and all the screws come out.
God let the dog jump off the Ute.I'm back in there sorting it out.Or I had an upset client because they didn't communicate something well.Those punches in the face are only significant if we let them keep us on the mat.So getting them to understand that persistence underpins their resilience and if they've got purpose in the morning, passion during the day and persistence in the afternoon, then they're they're absolutely set for an incredible life.
And vet his life is going to just come out of their pores and you get a shift in somewhere like that.Then the naysayers around them start to take notice and they become a flag bearer in themselves.Like if I look at the three superstars from the Resilience program last year, we've got young vets who are older than them, watching them now going, holy crap these young ones are coming through.
If we had vets like this in abundance, then the stress on me and you diminishes.The stress on the industry diminishes.The reps are coming into hospitals thinking, wow, this is blue sky now.The industry is safe.The animals are safe.
If we look at where the industry's going with more insurance people loving their animals even more over the next decade, we're in a good position if we can change this attitude.Amazing.So I I came across two podcast in the last month or so that had two very conflicting messages about resilience.
And I'd love to check your thoughts on it.The one was a doctor had written a book about stress and burnouts and the good stress and the bad stress and she talked about a concept called toxic resilience.So she said, well, the whole world's talking about resilience, but for a lot of people that looks like just keep going, you know, get the grind, get the hustle, go, go, go, get up.
But it's almost the it's that persistent part of it.Just keep getting off the mat.And she had the concept of no.Sometimes resilience means stepping back and recovering.We talk about that.And then in the same week I happened to listen to an interview with David Goggins which I'm sure you'd be familiar with and he, I've got actually wrote out a quote of something he said He's all about the stick.
He's he literally says it's all stick.It's no carrot, and his quote is, he says.I go to these fucking conventions and I look at the audience and these people sign up and they sign up every year and they come to the convention and they're thinking that they're going to learn something different.No, you're just lazy.
You know exactly what to do.It just sucks doing it.And I was like, what these are, I resonate with both of those.But yeah, what do you think?How do you find the balance between Goggins?Not being disrespectful, the Goggins, but I don't think he's being he probably hasn't been in an in an environment that's tough enough.
If I looked at one of the toughest men in my arena that I've ever seen as a guy called Henry Worsley, who was trying to break my record for the fastest crossing of the Antarctic continent coast to coast through the South Pole at 53 days.
The difference being he wasn't using wind power, it was all manpower, which is brutal.So you're pulling the sled.It's a shorter route, but he's pulling the sled from one side of Antarctica.He got to the pole and I had this horrible effect where he had beaten into a Mars bar that had snapped the tooth.
He was then taking a lot of pain meds because the tooth was exposed to the temperature as he breathing in and it's agony.He then burnt a hole in his stomach and pulled the sled for another seven days before he collapsed.And his last audio transmission is in the words of Shackleton, My dear, my bolt is shot.
I can no longer put one foot in front of the other.I'm done.And then literally, he collapses, gets picked up and dies on a surgical table in southern Chile.When they opened him up, he had got content all through his abdomen.He had pulled a sled for seven days with a ratchet stomach.
So, you know, that's Dave Goblin's approach and in the environment I'm working in, that will kill you.So the Venry environment is very similar.Like if you ignore those warning signs and don't pull the Maseratis and put them on blocks, let their engines cool down, they're going to do a Henry Worsley every time.
So learning from Henry, I know that I have a very good ability to recognize when I'm redlining, and it's easier when I'm traveling solo than when I'm with the team because I can recognize the Maserati syndrome and go listen.I'm making incredible mileage here and on the home run, on my last Antarctic crossing, I was doing an average of about 300 kilometers of ice travel in a day, which is hugely punishing.
Like your your skis are skipping, they're vibrating, your low back, your knees, your shoulders.You connected to a kite for up to 20 hours in a 24 hour day.I started to hallucinate and saw my daughter swimming in a in a swimming lane next to me.
I saw a BWS out there and I saw this.Here's another vet who is at our leaving party with a headband on dancing next to me.And where I saw it out of like a this is red line fever.And then you pull yourself aside, get into the tent, he double your calories, sleep for 8 hours and bring the temperature down.
So I think Dave Gomez approach does work for less severe scenarios, just harden up muscle through it.But it will lead to death in a veterinary environment.It'll lead to death in a polar environment.And I would love to take David Doggins through a 22 hour polar journey, you know when you're doing 300 kilometers operating in -55 Celsius air temp and see how he feels about pushing that last little bit because that will kill you every time.
So I think toxic resilience is super dangerous.It's really dangerous for our veterinary industry.It probably has killed some kids over the last decade, but there is an element of just muscle up and do it, but not when you start getting into that red zone.
That's so good.This is your new job, Jeff.We've got to get you and Dave Goggins under the adventure together.This is your your life mission.I would relish that there's a few other girls that I would like to humble.Have you got time for our quick fire round?
Yeah.Absolutely.Do you?Listen to podcasts.You said you listened to adventure podcasts when I asked you earlier.Yeah, absolutely.I'll listen to.You know, it's funny.My wife has got me into a new one as well.Well, essentially, Taylor Swift got Sarah into an NFL podcast called New Heights, Two brothers, the Kelsey brothers.
And then I've gone into it for the first time.I watched the Super Bowl this year and the passion that these guys play with and share across the New Heights podcast is is kind of, you know, in parallel to the passion we have for treating animals on a daily basis and what we need to perform on that highest level.
So I'll be really enjoying that one.You'll have to.I'll send you links.The pass along question is where I get my previous guest to ask a question for my next guest, not knowing who the next guest is.And my guest asked a while ago, we talked about it earlier that change in client expectations and animals becoming more and more part of the family and our level of care going up and up and up and up.
Is there a point where it is too much considering that large parts of the human race don't even have access to quality medical care?When is it too much?Yeah.That's a tough one because you look at, I feel like kidney transplant made possible.
Now it's kind of ludicrous because the cat that you're taking out off is going to need that kidney.We know that.So you're creating a problem to fix another one.I think, you know, there's ethical issues there that we know are Gray and I think that's too much.But when it comes down to family willing to put everything on the line for their animal, I think we've got to believe that's OK A, to do well in the industry, but B, to provide the level of care that people are demanding.
They want the same level of care for their pet as they have for themselves medically, which is obviously hard for us to match without a Medicare or Medi vet type system.So I don't think we're in danger of ever providing too much care.But then also understanding there's got to be some philanthropy we've got to play on back some funds into the developing world so that we're not getting that massive gap that, you know, my Labrador gets better treatment than my Afghani child.
You know, that's crazy.But there's always been that stretch, I suppose, between First Nation and, you know, developing nation.Have you got a question for my next guest?Yeah.I If we If you imagine the worst day you had in metric science, what was it that got me back off the mat?
Fantastic.I look forward to the answer to that.And then the last one, and I feel like this whole episode was kind of that, but maybe we can, maybe we can wrap up with one message.So you have an opportunity to speak to not just your toes and few in vet love, but to all of the new vet grads of the world as they say.
Jeff, you've got a couple of minutes, tell them one little thing.What's your one message to them?I think as a new grad coming in, you need to look in the mirror and just say to yourself you are effing amazing because you've you've prospered and personally gets rid of this point where you're now able to being a carer for these incredible animals.
You're able to make a difference for these families.You're able to be a positive voice in a pretty sick industry at the moment.We need flag bearers out there so don't accept anyone telling you this is the worst job in the world.You're not going to harm yourself.
We're going to protect you from that.You can do really well if you learn how to communicate and build for your time properly.You can do exceptionally well as as well as the dentists easily and you don't have to work all hours and self harm and and be depressed and substance abuse and not sleep.
All of that stuff is unnecessary.We can protect you from that.If you've got someone around you being negative then get the hell out of there.Protect yourself.It's almost like an abuse situation.If you feel like you're not safe and not protected and you don't have positive people around you, then move.
Don't let that mold, Don't let that poison get into your system or millicent about that.Just protect yourself that first two years of your career is going to set you up.I've never found anyone working in a negative environment in that first two years prosper.
You know, it's very hard to change your mindset that neuroplasticity is limited.You're going to get it set.If you're in a positive, dynamic, fun, happy environment, you got to do well.If you're in the opposite of that, then very fast.I like that.
The freaking amazing.The freaking amazing.And be the flag bearer.Yeah, that.Was so epic.I thought we were going to talk about adventure stuff.We didn't even get to that.I'm going to have to get you back on or at least meet you for a beer Subway and get some story.Jeff, thank you.
That was really spectacular.I think it's going to mean a lot.I can't wait to get this out there.Thank you for your time here.And thank you for what you're trying to do in the profession and globally.We've got a lot of things that you do.You're tackling global warming and adventuring, so the fact that you still commit so much love and passion to the vet profession is amazing and thank you for doing that.
Thank you, Hugh.Thanks so much for having me on.It's fun.Before you.Disappear.I wanted to tell you about our new weekly newsletter.I speak to so many interesting people and learn so many new things while making the podcast, so I thought I'd grant a little summary each week of the stuff that stood out for me.
We call it the Vet Vault 321 and it consists of firstly 3 Clinical Pearls.These are three things that I've taken away from.The clinical podcast episodes, my light bulb moments, the penny dropping, any new facts and the stuff that we need to know to make all the other pieces fit.
Then two other things.This could be quotes, links, movies, books, a podcast, highlight, anything that I've come across outside of clinical vetting that I think you might find interesting.And then one thing to think about.I'll share something that I'm pondering, usually based on something that I've read or heard, but sometimes it'll be just my own musings or ants.
The goal of this format is that you can spend just two to three minutes on the clinical stuff and move right along if that's all that you're after.But if you're looking for content that is more nourishing than cat videos or doom scrolling, then our two other things should send you in the right direction.And then something extra for when you feel like a slightly longer read.
If you'd like to get these in your inbox each week, then subscribe by following the newsletter link in the show description wherever you're listening to this.It's free, I think it's useful, it's fun, and it's easy to unsubscribe.If it's not for you, OK, We'll see you next time.

Dr Geoff Wilson