Aug. 4, 2019

#11: What is life like as a vet in industry? Dr Mina Hamilton

#11: What is life like as a vet in industry? Dr Mina Hamilton
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Season 1

We’ve always known that as part of our guest list we wanted to talk to vets from outside of clinical practice to provide us with some insights about parts of the profession that neither of us knows anything about. When it came to choosing who we should interview from the world of industry, today's guest was at the top of both of our lists.  Dr. Mina Hamilton is a smiling bundle of energy and enthusiasm who took her talents out of clinical practice and into life as an industry vet a few years ago when she decided to work for one of the leading pet food companies. When you watch Dr. Mina doing her thing at work you’re immediately struck by how much she makes it look like a lot of fun, which is exactly why we wanted to talk to her. We wanted to find out if it really is fun, and dig a bit into the whys, the hows, and the pros and cons.  Our conversation with Mina covers a wide range of topics. We talk about how you know whether or not a job is for you, about making the decision to stay or go in your job, and how to approach leaving when it is time to move on. Mina tells us what she loves about life as a technical vet, about the skills she’s learned in her role, about how to break bad habits, why holidays are so important, and much much more

Good evening.Ladies and gentlemen, this is Gerardo Poli. and this sorry one of the best bits of advice I've ever received was to find good mentors and to learn from them trusted people who have already done what you're trying to do.
Now.I've been fortunate throughout my career to have some fantastic mentors to help guide me, but I realize that they'd be hard to find and also hard to commit the time to 1.This is why we've gathered some of the best Minds from the Brave New World and squeeze them for their wisdom so that you don't have to learn the hard way with the help of our guests.
We flipped.It'd be proficient on its back and explore its soft underbelly to find the tips tools and inspiration that you'll need to build the career that you've always wanted.I'm Gerardo Poli.I'm Hubert him strapped and this is the vent valve.Hello everybody and welcome to another episode of the vet felt podcast today.
We are taking a bit of a D2L out of clinical practice.We've always known that is part of our guest list that we wanted to speak to vets from outside of clinical practice to vote to provide us with some insights about part of the profession that neither of us knew anything about when it came to choosing who we should interview from the world of Industry.
Today's guest was at the top of both of our lists.Dr. Mina Hamilton is a smiling bundle of energy And enthusiasm we took a talents out of clinical practice and into life as an industry event a few years ago when she decided to work for one of the leading pet food companies when you watch tough demeanor doing her thing at work, you're immediately struck by how much she makes it look like a hell of a lot of fun, which is exactly why we wanted to talk to her.
We wanted to find out if it really is fun and dig a bit into the wise the house the pros and the cons our conversation with mean it covers a wide range of topics we talk about Out how to know we're not your job is right for you or not about making decision when either stay or go and how to approach leaving when it's time for you to move on me and it tells us what she loves about being a technical veterinarian and the skills that you've learned and how to break bad habits.
And also why holidays are so important and much much more.Please plug-in sit back and lend your ears to dr.Mina Hamilton.Thanks for jumping on the the podcast.And it was something that you wrote in your bio and was something around being called the turtle lady or being known as the turtle lady.
You would think that you don't look anything like a turtle and I haven't can you explain what what the turtle lady?Yeah, sure.Well, I'll take it as a compliment that you think that I don't look like a turtle which is great.But yeah, I think the crazy Turtle lady was definitely a nickname that was given to me in vet school and carried through to professional life the way it's not happening.
Yeah.I know it's it's yeah, not a quite probably not quite as interesting a story as you think it might be but essentially what had happened with I used to work in an animal shelter and we used to get a lot of animals being surrendered.And one of the more common things that we used to get through were reptiles in particular Turtles and one day I was working in the wildlife area and we had a couple of pet turtles brought into the shelter and I offered to take them home because I thought that I could potentially give them a better space in my bathroom where they could repair where they could recuperate and recover from their medical conditions.
And so I took three Turtles home with me and three Turtles turned into 13 Turtles.Over a period of about yes, so it wasn't was it because they bread or anything crazy like that.You had a good so long.
That's kind of creepy.
Those are than apparently I was somewhat of a total expert and so the turtle started rolling in and I took them on and before I knew it.I was a vet student taking out a loan to set up my home as a turtle Sanctuary.I had three large tanks a terrarium where I could drive doc.
CZ ill Turtle.That's a joke.Yes, my cats and dogs causing havoc in the background, but then we also had a sling.A pool in the backyard for the turtles for the larger Turtle so not for us but for the turtles and I actually got pretty heavily involved in breeding insects because they used to eat so much food feeding 13.
Now it's was quite a chore.So yeah, so my place was quite interesting for a while there.So I did Turtle Foster caring for about three to four years and yeah and had quite a number of turtles come through my place.But at any one time I would have between sort of 13 to 15 Turtles at once.
So are we Okay, the the wild we're talking Wildlife or pit pit Turtles.It was actually a combination of both so with injured Wildlife so if they had shell fractures or absences, but then also a lot of pet turtles that perhaps weren't looked after to the best of the owners abilities and so they come in with all sorts of skin infection bone disease, and yes, I got pretty well-versed on Turtle medicine.
I did a lot of Turtle surgery and anesthetic once I actually graduated but when I was in vet school, yeah, I spent all my pennies on actually recovering these Turtles and it became a bit of a hobby for me but yet very rewarding very rewarding experience that the the skills you would have picked up into Turtles would have put you ahead of pretty much every other vet in the world as a new game that it's not have another people that know much about them.
That's a little lady I can see now how how that's relevant, you know Hubert has a nickname the doesn't like anyone to know and that's because it sounds a bit like That's cool that I absolutely hate that no one knows and sometimes they call me yet.
And I just I'm so used to just like letting it slide like I yes I'll respond to it.So I don't let anything happen.So because they'll catch on they'll be like if I if I let loose that that this particular name is what I don't like the most out of anything.
I'm fairly certain.Everyone's like home yet, especially working.That's the kind of that's our how to tell her no.No, but but thank you.Yeah, you've now given me a new life goal is to get you out of drunk and every year we have this at an annual meetings.
We had this tell one thing that our like our closest biz.As partners and managers and stuff don't know about you and like I struggle and I lived this one comes up frequently like no don't say that.I don't trust anyone.I'm finding some trust issues there a little bit around this time.
Yeah, but we did you ever did you think about I don't know transition into reptile medicine or something or was it just a thing you did in the side but smile practice was something where you want to head into or you know, what?With your did it actually result in anything as far as I absolutely thought that I was going to end up being some sort of reptile vet.
I got so into it at one point, but I think when I graduated there world of veterinary medicine kind of opened up before me and there were so many other things to learn and so many other things to sort of get good at and build skills in that even though I kept doing all the turtle medicine stuff on the side.
I developed interest in other things.So if you actually Googled because I was working in Melbourne in a north and a practicing Northeastern suburbs.And if you actually Googled Turtle vet my name would pop up as a supposed Turtle expert which terrified me when I found out because I thought all these people are going to start bringing their Turtles to me and expect that I can do a good job of this so there was immense pressure to get even better at it when I graduated.
So yeah.Yeah, so very cool turtles are pretty amazing creatures.I love Turtles I used to have Numbers of fish and are provided on the fact that I had a big tank which had different continents fish from different content and the Wayne one tank which apparently you should never do and never had and I was like, yeah, I can do this and I'm like, I'm not like a hundreds about 40 fish in this big tank.
So it really good and then I let loose a little bit that I was kind of pretty okay with with fish medicine stuff.And now there is a push to try to you know, get me on Facebook or putting in the web.Yeah, like the fish doctor.I'm like No, no, that's the race.
That's the reason to be careful.What you say you like especially especially with the feels that there's that there's really almost nobody who does it.All you need to have is a an inkling of an interest and a little bit of more skills than everybody else and suddenly you the specialist in you go and I still know almost nothing.
I just know a little bit more than yeah.The rest of you don't want to do it exactly right.So being a you for years it to practice you becoming skilled a general Is you're good at total medicine then you do your Masters in small animal studies and it's certainly working as a as an industry event for a real Cannon.
What what prompted that shift?Yes.Um, I think it surprised a few people in my life when I finished my masters and was sort of on a path to I wanted to specialize.I really wanted to further my skills in medicine and then all of a sudden I was actually on holidays.
I was in Thailand and and I'll sitting on a beach and I was just Just thinking about life.I'd actually just finished reading the seven habits of highly effective people.I was sitting on the beach.I was yeah, it's great book and I was really just reflecting on where I was at in my life and I'd realized that I think I developed what a lot of vets and call in our profession of three it, you know, you get to about three years out and you start to feel like you need more and even though practice had a lot of challenges daily.
I was really looking for that next big challenge.I was looking for a steep learning curve and I Different quite getting it in what I was doing in practice.So I actually really enjoyed where I worked I had great mentors.I worked in a practice that had great standard of medicine standard of care and I just got to the point where I thought I actually don't think that I could get much better than this from a clinical practice experience and and I want to do something totally different but still use my bit degree.
So sitting on the beach there in Thailand, I actually said our Royal candid sales rep a message and said said you seem happy in your job.What's Royal Cannon like to work for and and got back a response from her and next thing I know I found out that they were actually looking for a technical veterinarian and I applied so I sort of just fell into it having this moment of self-reflection on the beach on holidays realizing that I really didn't want to go back to work.
You know, there's not wanting to go back because you want to stay on holidays and then there's just not wanting to go back and that was where I got into so I just decided to change course and do something totally different.King I would take 12 months off gain gain a little bit of it that challenge that I was looking for but get a little bit of a break mentally and emotionally from practice but for years on I'm still working at the technical vet.
It's it's been extremely rewarding and something that I've unexpectedly become really passionate about.Wow, it's cool.I like I like the whole thing which is which is you're feeling something right and then you took action on it not necessarily saying that everyone who feels like they have a three you to shoot change career and jumps, you know from clinical practice SRI bit.
You're like what I admire about the fact is that actually you took action on something and you know, ask that question, you know, imagine if you didn't and you sat there ruminating over it and you never asked that that rep, what was it like, you know, mmm.Yeah, absolutely and I'm a big fan of this whole concept of like trusting your journey.
I think that you know, when you when you work really hard towards something like a Veterinary degree, it's always with you you never lose.That regardless of whether you step off the veterinary career track to do something else.You'll always remain a bit.So in my mind, it wasn't a risk in it wasn't it wasn't major to me because I think when you step off your career path, that's where you learn the most and so I was just looking for then.
You know, what other skills can I learn that will actually help me be a better veterinarian in the long term.I just haven't come back to being a better veterinarian yet.So what have you learned about yourself as a rule are working in this position that that That surprised you.
I've learned a lot of new skills.I think one of the things that took me by surprise and I was possibly a bit naive about to be honest taking on the role was that this type of role requires a lot of public speaking and prior to stepping into this role.I wouldn't say that I was nervous at sorry.
I was definitely nervous about public speaking.I think I've always been good at talking but I'm not sure that I've been good at public speaking and so taking on the role.I remember in the interview they said oh, you know, they could be a little bit of public speaking.Are you okay with that?And I thought yeah, I think I'm okay with that and seven days into my role.
Yeah.Sorry Jurado, but when you go to a practice and there's two beds and for nurses, you know, it's probably spent.Yeah.Yeah.Absolutely, you know, you do a client night and 10 people show up and you tell them about puppy nutrition or something random and you think yeah that's public speaking and then within a week of me being at Royal Cannon an opportunity popped up for a vet from the business to present at one of the big benefits.
He conferences.It's a hundred 20 bits.It's a breakfast session.And hey, and hey, we want you to present on renal disease and how nutrition can help and and yeah, if I hadn't have been so new to the office.I think I would have thrown up right then and there when they asked me I was genuinely just crapping myself over this and yeah, I spent nights sleep so many sleepless nights in the lead up to it and the night before I barely slept a wink but but after ticking it off and getting up there and presenting that was that's pretty much the beginning of what has since been a lot of public speaking and now I feel so confident in just getting up in front of a room full of people and talking about anything and it doesn't matter how many people in the room and it doesn't matter who they are.
There's just that confidence now that you're not going to dine everything's going to be okay, you know, well, it's just like that massive kind of push the boundaries where like something where I suppose you didn't really maybe you did have the Person to say no, but you were kind of stuck with the option and you kind of you know be new to the company like okay.
Should I should do this as my chance, right but really in taking doing doing what you couldn't taking action and and then the outcome was that you push such a big boundary that it was stuff is so much easier now because you've done that.Yeah, absolutely.
And it's a huge part of my role now.So internally, we do a lot of public speaking to do training.So we teach our internal Associate's about nutrition, but externally there's a lot of public speaking and so it's one of those skills that you can't really work on in clinical practice.
You do publicly speak to a degree but to do it in front of large audiences and to put together presentations that are engaging and leave in packed I think is a totally different skill set that I don't think I would have Wives have the opportunity to develop.Hmm.Now the first time I met you mean it was that you did a little talk a little presentation and oh, yeah that pretty much resulted partially new being here because being Dorado were discussing that we we wanted to talk to her to an industry V8 on the podcast and he said yeah, I know this this one way that I would know Kno I've got the perfect fit.
I sort of talked and she's so well-spoken and enthusiastic and bubbly and it was there was you so there we go here.You have a natural Talent.Yeah, I think it comes with time definitely a lot of practice.I feel a bit.
Sorry for the audience as I first spoke to maybe in the first six months of my role.But yeah, no, thank you.It's nice to know that you leave an impact when you do get up there and you present so that's great.But where did you learn?Did you have a specific you do specific training courses or just learn on the job.
How do you prove that skill or what was your path to improving on it?So I think definitely learning on the job is the biggest way that I've learned how to publicly speak but I'd actually did do a formal public speaking course and it was you attended for a full day.
And it was a real immersion in public speaking, you know, you show up you're in the room with you know, 10 people that you've never met before and in the first half an hour you're asked to do a presentation on a hobby that you enjoy so it doesn't really matter what the topic is, but you had to get up and present.
So and you presented All times over the course of the day and say video you which is terrifying might I add and and then everybody watches the video back with you and gives you 8 Grand critiques you and critiques your public speaking or what you could do to have more impact and have more present.
So that was a really interesting experience.But I've also done a fair bit of media training with royal Cannon as well.I think that's another thing that you another skill set that you just don't get the chance to develop as a clinical practice bet is the ability to get up in front of Media and do radio interview then speak to journalists and and get your key messages across.
What was the name of the of the course that you did it was called?Yeah, it's called present Inspire but they're in the show notes in case anybody's ever interested.It is a major barrier and I totally think that some as some people may have looked at the job description and and freak out a bit about the whole public speaking thing and and I would like from personal experience as well.
I do a lot of Continuing professional development seminars in Forks in front of students and things where there could be a couple hundred but it was a progression.It's not like as if we got to the point where we are now where we feel comfortable without you know months and years of fumbling and and then asking for advice and Alex and I every time we speak we always include and robbed three of us if we're speaking somewhere and were the other people listening we always ask for feedback.
Like what can we do?Better what we did.Well, what could we do better?And it's kind of just one thing one thing.Sometimes it's like are you saying I'm a lot.So now I'm very conscious about that.The other thing would be I used to put my hands in my pockets.
So then I'll it conscious about that.So and forever kind of improving it's good to have safe but people who you trust and and you value their advice, but it's it's not like as if anyone stepped into their particular field or stepped into their professional In knowing everything it it says you took you time to learn how to how to take out Turtles.
It took you like time had to be comfortable with general practice.You do continuing professional development to be get better at general practice.Right?And then you you did further training in media and also public speaking, you know, so it's a combination of everything where you are some people don't see that that's years and practice and stress as well like your journey as you said before we trust in your journey.
Which is awesome got you to where you are now, so it's not like as if there's land in your lap was it?No, I definitely not I think you're right.It takes it does take a lot of work and getting out of your comfort zone.I think that's the biggest thing is the work is actually taking that step and making that decision to get out of their comfort zone and like you say Jurado feedback is a gift.
It actually really is, you know, your body deceives you in the worst ways when you're nervous that the nervous thing that I used to do when I was public speaking was I cross my legs.And sometimes I'd sway.So I've sort of almost look like I was humping are at the front of the room which isn't really socially inappropriate things to do when you need that feedback because I had no idea I was doing this and so, you know, somebody said to me.
Hey you do this really weird thing when you speak and it's really distracting also quite strange.But yeah three isn't your public speaking career and just like I didn't notice that Did this we'd love to be awesome.
We should do a survey.
Yeah, pretty down a few notches, right so there yeah.A lot of people myself included at some stage.They go considered jobs outside of clinical practice and it specifically in an industry roller door technical veterinarian role, but I think and I think my stumbling block was I didn't really know what it what it entails don't know what you do.
I had this these visions of be so bored.Just looking for practice to practice trying to sell vaccines.What's the reality?What is a day in the life of me look like If there is such a thing, I think that's a great question here.
But because I actually had no idea when I took the role what I would be doing every single day and I think a lot of it don't consider it because they're not aware of what the role actually entails and to be honest I describing a day for you in the life of meaner is actually quite hard because every day is so different in this job.
And that's one of the reasons why I enjoy it and I think that's one of the reasons why it's kept my interest for four years is that it is so different.Current so in a nutshell you become a Veterinary expert within a corporate business.So you become the go-to person for the marketing team because they're trying to ensure that what they're communicating is both creative and scientifically accurate.
So you get a lot of experience working with marketing working with sales.You also manage key stakeholder relationships, especially if those stakeholders are veterinarians you manage those relationships for the business.You become influential in attending industry Association meetings and helped to lead this practice in that particular field.
So that's something that I'm particularly passionate about.You become the expert in nutrition in my case.It's nutrition working for Royal Canin, but you become the expert in nutrition to help veterinarians have got complicated clinical cases.You become an escalation point for pet owners that need more in-depth advice about what to feed if particularly where their animals have.
Of medical conditions and are on therapeutic diet and you become the trainer within the business both internally and externally, so it's quite a varied role and every day.I'm working on something different so some day if I could be writing scientific content for our blog or reviewing scientific literature and then on other days I might be leading projects on veteran mental health and awareness, which is something Dorado was involved in which was the love your pet.
Love your vet campaign.You get the opportunity to leave.These projects that you have a lot of passion for but a totally unrelated to nutrition.Okay, it's extremely varied and and I think that's why it's actually maintain my interest because I am the sort of person that likes new challenges all the time.
So this type of role will certainly give you that.Yeah, you mentioned there something actually which like a situation or scenario where you step it onto.Or people asking you for advice as a expert in your field, you know, and especially when offering advice on I suppose big big things big things which impact profession as a whole and or with big players.
I suppose or big names in the industry.So, how do you how do you tackle that?You know, how did you tackle me in a comment on board?Someone know what you know the person that may never heard before but Install raising up and talking about you know, what do you know?
Yeah.Ximena's in what can you give me an example Dorado of what you mean?Yeah.Okay.So let's say I don't know.I don't exactly know the particular scenario.I'll give you a scenario and this maybe might be to find one which is applicable but maybe the a VA or something cause they're up and they're thinking about some kind of legislative change or something and they want to involve all aspects of the profession and Industry.
And they go okay.We need a veterinarian that that is knowledgeable on, you know, pet food diets or and so forth how you have about was and then raw Cannon sends you a long but in a high State big player kind of meeting.How do you kind of hold your own in there or how do you step into those?
Yeah.Okay.I see what you mean.And yes those opportunities do come up and you get in you get the ability to be a Veterinary expert but also an expert in that field that you're in so in my case that's nutrition.And and I think in those cases, I think you have to know your value.
I think that's a really big thing.It can be quite an intimidating situation and this role does present you with opportunity to be a part of bigger picture project that as you say effectively the whole industry and help to lead change and I think in those situations, the really important thing to do is to to know the value of knowing your value.
Hmm.It's to really understand that in that situation.I really do believe.That I know a lot about nutrition and I lo I know a lot about dog and cat health and enough to be able to advise and provide good advice on what could lead good change or what could lead best practice in that in whatever that situation might look like.
So I think it's about knowing your value and those intimidating conversations.Yes, they come up in this role because you know, they're sort of big players in an industry or yet big projects that that lead a lot of change, but I think those types of The patients even come up in clinical practice.
If I'm not wrong to say that that you know often you do get stuck as a veterinarian or even as an expert in any field feeling unworthy and you do have to remind yourself in those situations that that you do have a lot of value and you do deserve to be there and to have an opinion when you when you talk about value for back.
What would be like the first for backe fall back on, you know, if you ever feel like as if you like feel bit intimidated here or or you know a bit uncertain about what you can bring to the table.Is there a fallback that you fall back upon, you know, which is yeah that that's your first step to realize in remembering that you bring value to this to this meeting.
Absolutely.It's kind of like your own personal coaching, right and for me, it's reminding myself of what I do know because I think in those in that headspace you get so overwhelmed by all the things that you don't know and you have to remember you don't need to know everything you are.
There for a purpose.So whether you're a clinical practice that in a consult room with a client that has certain expectations of you or you're in an industry meeting like something I might attend at the end of the day you're there for a purpose and all you need to be confident about is all the things you do know and don't worry about all the things.
You don't know.Hmm because that will only that will only Cloud your judgment and and get you in a terrible head space.I think that's really valuable advice and like I was I am a very similar thing as well, especially several years back when I stepped into head examiner role of the at the Australia New Zealand Veterinary College in terms of in the chapter of emergency critical care.
That was a big step up for me and I did that role for a few years in a row, but the first year was was it quite a lot of battle in my own head, you know, what do I bring to the table when there's people here you are Specialists people who have Years of experience writing exams and running members like running in exams for the college, but then I used to always fall back on I'm here for a reason they saw something in me.
And what do I do what you know, what am I bringing?I'm bringing what I know and that's what I used to always kind of Channel back to and have it the core because then I always that would then have you say in part my belief in myself and then it would change my mindset and and stop the spiral of Doubt.
So now it's interesting to hear because That's similar things to what I do.So yeah, things are absolutely that's okay.And I think it reflects in general practice.And I mean, you know clients sometimes ask pretty obscure questions of us, you know, I've certainly been asked about whether I know anything about the medicine of spiders and you know, and really random things that you know as a vet.
You cannot be expected to know and so I think that yes, sometimes, you know started was probably an extreme example, but sometimes even in a consult Setting for vets especially as new graduates, you can very quickly spiral and let the things you don't know chick away your confidence.
And so, you know remind yourself of everything you do know and know your value in that it's excellent.I've seen that in a few new grads where they still it still see themselves as a student and you and then you have to set it in.No, actually I could walk out the practice at leave you don't have to ask my advice you have permission to you've just gone through enough to be able to give a it's a valid opinion.
So they're just just do it.Yes, absolutely confidence.Yeah, so it sounds like a like a fascinating job.Are they other downsides?What does it do at the risk of of you or your employee is listening to this week?
I want an industry.Yeah, look as if you're listening from Royal Kennett, no, no, it's not like that at all.I think honestly.Lee you're probably asking the wrong person in that setting because I actually I actually really do enjoy my job.
I think we're I think things could turn into negatives is if you're not prepared for some of the very unique sort of challenges of this job and one of those things is that there's quite a bit of travel.So I personally really enjoy travel there's domestic travel opportunities, but international travel opportunities, I just grab with both hands very excited about those, but I know for some people Life on travel very exhausting.
They don't want to be away from home like a bit more routine and structure.So I think if you're that type of person and this type of role would very quickly sort of cause a lot of fatigue, but I personally love that and I love the travel opportunities.I think the other thing too that that probably a lot of technical veterinarians feel is a big con and it's probably the most obvious one is that you miss out on clinical practice.
You don't get the time to dedicate to being a clinical veterinarian.It is what you studied for all those years, but I think at the same time if you can you do have time whatever time you do have on weekends.If you really are passionate about that, you can devote some of that time to working in practice and I certainly did that.
I locums as a veterinarian when I first started as a technical vet.I kept a hand in practice and I know technical vets that continue to do that on a regular basis, but it comes at a cost.I think, you know, you do need to take some time for yourself and rest.I'd imagine in your Position or anybody's position who it in one of their industry roles that get to see a lot of Ed practices and it traveled internationally to congress's and speak speak to lots of different people in the industry.
You'd have a pretty good.I would say an outside view but an overall view of the of the vetri profession as a whole has it changed in your time at your current job.And and how where do you see it in 10 years time.
Hey wow head question.So thank you actually, no, don't be I love a good loaded question.Now, I think look I do actually some often describe my role exactly as you've just sit here that is when I was working in practice.
It was it felt very small, you know, you sort of working away in a practice somewhere and you are doing your job day in day out and you know that you're a part of this bigger industry, but you don't have full exposure to it and I feel like now networking feel like I'm on the outside of Industry looking in and I have noticed a few things and and I'm very pleased to say that I think the media has picked up on some of this recently and that's really the stuff around Victory mental health and being more aware that that veterinarians actually do suffer from a lot of mental health issues.
And that suicide is something that does strike our profession more than others and that has become far more apparent to me now that I'm actually moving around between veterinary clinics speaking to Veterinary.Ian's from all across the country and even over across New Zealand it's becoming more and more obvious to me that a lot of veterinarian for struggling and a lot of veterinarians that have been in practice for perhaps as long as I have so not new graduates, but not, you know, long time veterinarian sort of been in the industry for 15 plus years, but sort of that those that somewhere in the middle a lot of them are leaving the industry and and I'm certainly feeling that in my own pee.
Having left and doing up various different things but also owners are Veterinary practices commenting to me that you know, they're finding it hard to find experience.That's that have been out four to five to ten years.So I think that I don't I actually don't know what's going to happen to the industry moving forward, but I expect that there's going to be massive change and I think that it will be changed for the better but some of this, you know, we've got to take a really good look at the industry and see what we can do to improve it and prove the working conditions for veterinarians because it is a really tough job as you both know both emotionally and physically it's very demanding and and people get really worn out.
We're all human and we all get worn out in the same ways that Citrus exert.So do you think it's From when you started watching it as it as it changed in this period of time for the for the worse or for the better that's almost five years that you've been watching.
I think I think it's probably stayed much the same to me.I think it's more it for me.It's actually just been more of an awareness piece.I don't think I've ever had the opportunity to reflect back in on the industry and take a really good look at at how people are sort of coping have veterinarians are working and and now with my job I get so much.
Exposure get the opportunity to travel around the country and visit so many veterinary practices and work with so many veterinary groups and attend so many veterinary conferences.I feel like I've met thousands of vets and nurses over the last four years as a technical veterinarian and it just in my conversations with their my feeling is that it's a tough industry to work in a very rewarding one one that everyone seems so passionate about but there's no question that it was tough.
Absolutely at the risk of giving away by my advancing age and said Lee said it just in my time.You just push pushing towards 20 years now since it's in studying studying with resigns no over 20 years.If I can't my study is they have been changes for the better in that regard specifically this definitely if nothing else the fact that as you say that that we are talking about it a lot more.
It feels to me that when I Started or pretty more pre when I started people except just accepted.It was just a given.Wow.Well, that's you want to be a wait shut up and put up with it and the expectation of my generation and Beyond is increasingly.
That's just not good enough.It doesn't have to be this way and let's find better alternative.So I think it's I think it's changing for the better.I think we think we'll get there.Yeah, I think that's a good point.Now that you say that reflecting back on when I graduated.
It was very much a you know, it's going to be tough and that's a it's kind of a rite of passage that you have to do it.You have to do it tough, especially as a new graduate to sort of earn your stripes in the industry, but I think more and more.Yeah, it is changing for the better.
There's great mentoring programs available now for new graduate veterinarians, but as well as that I am hearing the back.Tivity at a veterinary school level where students are becoming more aware of their own Mental Health and Welfare.So there are you know student Welfare Association groups or special interest groups and they put on events at a university level where they have hot chocolate days or yoga J's or whatever.
It might be.I've heard a lot of those types of activities.So I think it's very cool.And I think it's great that it's actually starting from that school.Absolutely.I was listening to podcasts for the day by Brendon burchard high performance experience of thinking this hbx and you had Joe dispenser and a guy who wrote a book about breaking your habits and his big thing.
He is around the use of meditation and mindfulness in terms of slowing down your thoughts because your thoughts become your actions and so forth.And if you're a bit more aware of your thoughts, even in a slow process, you can then control somewhat your actions and then that goes around in the cycle because your actions and the influence to you your values and then your thoughts again, so and it was interesting you say they're about yoga being used and actually be interesting to see at what stage of transition into mindfulness and meditation actually or whether there's a movement in down that direction.
Round just actually slowing down your thoughts and being a bit more conscious about your thoughts hot chocolate actually would be a good way of slowing down your thoughts and a cold day.We like anything chocolate related has to be the bride's day of mental health support every practice for as long as I've been in the industry.
It's been the only thing that's a really busy we Underwood Hospital we have bread. and and and it spreads and fruit available most like throughout the whole week and we went through a phase where be used to have like one of those megatons of Milo, you know, like the you know, I don't know like four key items for kilos of yeah, but like really big ride and it's like no one could go to that much Milo and feel ill but we used to churn through so much Milo we have to bring out a policy which has one scoop the In work at all, but obviously chocolate helps it some way have moments where I used to choke on the Milo because they put too much milder and you guys over there.
There's there's my load choking coughs where you're kind of like, yeah.Yeah exactly to be able to breathe Milo basic accommodation.And I think it was sort of this is used to have two spoons of Milo.
With with coffee and then another 2 spoons of sugar.Oh my God, that's quite a high.What you need is just powdered milk then and you go back to the new grad just graduated end of this year and she told That they actually do discuss it.
They had they have sessions on mindfulness on meditation, which is fantastic that the talk about it.She just did the guy criticism was it was sort of seen as a an extra thing and that always shared a little tied up on a Friday afternoon after lunch or something.
So all anybody cares about is getting home and and going hey going on the weekend.So she said they didn't didn't spend enough time on it.But at least they touching on it, which I think is fantastic.Well, there's so much research around that now and It is such a movement and there's proven clinical benefits around it as well.
And I know that we talked about this in a previous podcast.There's numerous apps can get whichever free which can just help that process of being in control of your thoughts.And it's you going to train your mind leave your brain has somewhere between 60 to 70,000 thoughts a day, right?
And if you keep on thinking those same thoughts, right?What's your future going to be the future is going to be the same?Was yesterday so until you actually try to start influencing what you think and you know, and the way they do that is by stopping grain and really be in control of try to be in control.
So the influence of the way you think then you're going to keep on thinking the same thing if you just going to be the same so, you know, are you do you have any any practice or anything in this regard that that you do?Yeah.I love meditation a very big fan.
I've got a couple of apps in my phone and I do a lot.A lot of guided meditation actually do it in between finishing work and carrying on with the rest of my evening during the week because it's just really nice for me to kind of wind down and let go of work meaner and and transition into yeah, whatever it is.
I might be doing that evening and I think exercise is another really big one.It's huge for me.It clears my mind completely and I think the more intense the exercise the better it seems to be for me because it gives me no opportunity to think of anything else.Apart from breathing crazy Milo.
Have you got any favorite apps out of the the meditation app to use?Which ones do you recommend?I really like the smiling mind.That's a really good one and there is also a yoga studio app and it's particularly good because there are yoga sessions that you can do on there that I think there's 10 minutes 20 minutes 30 minutes ago. 30 minutes so you can choose how much time you want to dedicate and there's a yoga session or a meditation session there for you and I find it particularly good especially when I am traveling around that I can still get of take my yoga and meditation with me.
So that's a really good one yoga studio.I think it's a small cost for the app, but it's actually it's a great app.Well, well if it yeah, it's lovely has becoming more mainstream.My my kids are 6 and almost eight year old boy.
Is the school has Wellness week this week and that that includes starting the day with yoga my eight-year-old.I saw their lesson plan for the day the other day and they were talking about growth mindsets versus fixed by it sits at several years all those like a Fed - stick.
I've just learning about it now.I think I think these are There's Hope for the for the future Generations.It's funny you say that it's so cool my niece.She's a new 7.So just early High School.Cool, and they had a week at school called failure week.
Wow, what they had to do.What I had to do for the entire week was focused on something that they are terrible at that they frequently fail at and it was around building confidence around you know that you're just not going to be good at everything and and the importance of working hard at something that if you're not good at it.
You can actually work hard and Achieve, you know what you want to achieve a bit.So I think for her it was chin-ups or something.Especially caught yeah, but she's not a very athletic she's really creative but she's not very athletic and and she started off just being able to sort of hang off the bar and I think she did two or three chin up by the end of the week and she was so pleased with this hundred percent increase, right?
Yeah 0 to 3 and 3 is like I don't know that's not even a percentage just like exactly that's how do you do because you had one and one two three.A hundred so be even more.Yep.I love it pretty amazing.
Yeah, if you play the numbers so it's really amazing and there are wreck it makes a big difference.So yeah.Here you go, mate.All right, so we talked about some of the struggles that people are going through and and some of the changes that we need to see but I love that in our lead up to this conversation with you.
You said you see the veteran degree as a Golden Ticket.I'd love to talk about that explain explain more.Look when you study a Veterinary degree.I think we can all agree that there is the law.
That you learn and you come out with a pretty unique set of skills and a lot of knowledge.And so what I mean about it being a golden ticket is I think we shouldn't underestimate how much you know as a veterinarian and how much value you can add across so many Industries, so it's not just about you know, working in clinical practice or even as a technical veterinarian like I do it's even across government.
It's across, you know, various Industries where your skills and your knowledge is going to be Laughter and valued and so in my mind I see a vet Med degree is a golden ticket to so many Avenues in your career.So that's what I mean about it being a golden golden ticket is that I think that it can take you so many places and not just in different Industries or down different career paths, but also around the world, you know, veterinarians are needed everywhere in this world.
And so I think it's a golden ticket if you are interested in travel or you want to see different parts of the world or live elsewhere.It's a it's a seriously great profession to be in one of the best thing that I can attest to then I would have I've lived in three continents.
With my help, we got in relatively easily to Australia, but but it opened doors and then I have friends who are Specialists medical doctors who want to move from South Africa Australia and it's really hard they have to redo exams ten years after they it's City just like thank goodness.
It's just a good good University to Vision degree from a good University is really fantastic for that.You talked before about the 3-year itch for me.It's about two years before I feel like I got a Triad transition to something or use their skills to build into something else.
What would you say to a veterinarian?What advice would you give a friend a suppose?If they go?Look I'm feeling like I'm stuck in a not not progressing and so forth.Is there any kind of tips that you would have?For that person who's feeling that itch?
Yeah, sure.I think I look as much as I am very much about trust your journey and try for I'm really big advocate for try something different step off the warning track and do something totally different.But I think at the same time it's a bit of look before you leap, you know be really sure that whatever you're looking at is the challenge you want.
Not just the change you're after so don't just change things for the sake of change be sure that what you're stepping into is going to be something that you'll enjoy and that you You'll you know jump in with both feet.So I think yeah, you know definitely seek out those challenges but really reflect, you know, what is it that I want to achieve, you know, do I want change because I want to live elsewhere.
Do I want change because I want different skills.I want to learn something different.Do I want to surround myself with different people?You know, what is the reason for the change and I think you really have to get down to the real nitty-gritty about why you want that change before you make the change.
Mmm Yeah, like I that's amazing advice there because when sometimes when you think about the kitchen you think about change sometimes it's actually running away from something you actually should probably tackle, you know, if the situation and you aren't position is not conducive for you to do proper work, but it's because of your colleague or because of the environment or something is not actually providing you what you need or the it's you know, I suppose not facilitating you growth and conversations I think would be a much portmanteau you noatak.
Clean that and trying to deal with that and seem bent on you can created the environment you need through conversation.I think would be a powerful step in order than sort of solidify and then you've done what you needed to do before kind of jumping and leaping sort of running away.
You are looking to step towards something.Yeah as opposed to running away from something.Absolutely.Yeah, you're right.You can create change exactly where you are.You don't have to change.Rated so job.So whatever it might be, you know, you can create change right there.
It might be more difficult.It might present more of a challenge.But hey, the greater the challenge often greater the rewards so it might be worth investing where you are and trying to create that change for yourself there.Absolutely deciding what it is you want to do when you realize okay this this is not necessarily the anymore that that can be a challenge, but you said something in your story that At that, I find quite quite important in this this is from from personal experience as well.
You were sitting on a beach in Thailand on holiday when you figured it out.It's very very hard to think clearly about where you are and where you want to be if you working 50 60 hours a week, you're exhausted their literature struggling to keep your head above water.
So I think it's started to personally to me to save make some space if you go if you feel like I'm I'm dissatisfied see if you can cut Back workout take a holiday do something to get in a different headspace.And then when you do go on holiday dough just get first every night and sleep make some Sizzle that has a gold selling to go there to to commit a bit of time for me personally.
I had to either cut back drastically on clinical hours to try and figure things out and it did it work is as soon as you've got some head space then things start falling into place.Yeah, absolutely and getting some distance from what you feel that you need changing gives you amazing perspective.
And what you select to say something that I was I was trying to freak you out by putting depending you and the camera you mentioned before about mentoring and so forth and and form.
I understand.You've done a couple years as a mentor.As part of the API maybe a mentoring program.Is there if you could I suppose.Distill all the advice you've given in to a couple kind of little key areas, you know like it and they're generally you'd like the questions you get out.
I get asked to around tackling things that people have never done before so sort of, you know concerns around competency and confidence and things like that.That's the main kind of stuff that I get asked when you veterinarians come through is the doubt of the their own doubt in terms of their ability to do things.
But as a mentor of a three years you would have been asked numerous questions were offered quite a lot of advice to new graduate Marion's what kind of areas I suppose would be the key areas in which you ask questions so that people I suppose you could offer that advice to thousands of people.
Yeah.Sure.I think so over the three years that I've been participating in the mentoring program the true sort of key areas that I think of questions that I get very early on from new graduates is a Taking the right job.Definitely one that people just go around in circles around there's so much doubt and confusion around is you know, is this the right job for me?
And the second one would be around interpersonal relationships.How do I sort of manage some of the people that I work with?How do I manage the relationships I have with them.How do I get them to understand my value as a new graduate Veterinary being that I have all this knowledge may be my skills aren't so great, but my knowledge is fat.
Fantastic, and how do I get them to trust me and trust my knowledge?So those are probably the two main questions that I think I get asked So that obviously the is this the right job for me the very initial stuffs at the very beginning of the mentoring program and I really find that that you know, as a new graduate veterinarian.
There's almost this, you know, what's the Pinnacle of a perfect job that people build up in their mind and then they go searching for it and then when great jobs fall in their lives, you know, they really do kind of Swish the small stuff and really start to tease out all the details and start over think things.
So I think that's a really challenging time.It's actually even just finding a job that's right for you and meets your your expectations or what goals you have in mind around the first job.What would be the you know the advice you'd give them I suppose yeah.
So this is this is just my personal advice.I don't know if this is like the best advice but the advice that I generally offer them because I I suppose I'm I'm not an over-thinker and sometimes that's to my detriment I should think about the details more than I do as you probably know for me taking this job with royal Cannon without fully understanding what it was when I took it. probably let you know had Sunburn and Sun heat stroke and then toxicated with Any cocktails which everyone you were drinking at the time to get out?
So yeah, I think because I am not an over-thinker.I feel like I can help in the face because I can kind of pull it right back and say okay.Yes.There are 20 things that we would want in an ideal job.But what are the three things that are most important?And to you and if a job text those three things, will you be satisfied with it?
And if the answer is yes, then just make that your criteria because you're not locked into your first job and if it does go pear-shaped there are other options and there is an opportunity to move on.I feel like some of this fear and anxiety and overthinking actually comes from a place of I'm terrified that this is the one and only job that I'll ever get offered or you know, I'll take it and everyone else will carry.
Eon and I'll be miserable and there's a lot of fear and anxiety around it because there's a lot of pressure placed on your first job, but in reality, what are your three things that are most important to you?And if that job takes those three things then I say go for it.That's awesome.
That's great advice is nice.Nice very good advice.I wonder if it was like so simple it's like one Milo and sugar exactly.Honestly, some people are that simple and and others need more.
So in those three things those three things to huge things and that's okay too.I think it's you know, it's your first job is such an individual thing.It's a very personalized choice.So I find it quite challenging as a meant for when new graduate vets.
Come to me and say do you think this is a good job because that really depends on who we're talking about.I totally totally based on perspective.And what they want it's like a whole thing about work-life balance.It kind of makes me kind of cringe whenever the someone says that it's like what is it?
And what is the perfect work-life balance?It's actually so individual people look at my life and go you have no work.I work in the stuff.I love working and I work in it whenever I want to work in just one o'clock in the morning.I work in it.So going to the gym 12 o'clock at night sometimes so, you know, like it's my life.
I can do whatever I like and they do underway doesn't there any names of cocktails?Good lie cheat.Okay.I'm kind of like yeah, I'll give that one a go.I've had a horrible experiences with vodka, but this one goes but the second question was the interpersonal relationship.
And I know you wouldn't you can answer.What would be the one question you would ask their butt and it's a bit of a tricky one there.Yeah.I think that one comes down to its individual scenarios and often.It's Often it's about new graduates feeling a bit hamstrung, you know, they have certain thoughts or ideas around how to manage cases or you know, they might even have new ideas to bring to the table, but they're not quite sure how to how to do so and and that's usually the underlying issue in many of those conflicts.
So I think it's more about coaching them around its going back to that knowing your value knowing what's appropriate how to present an idea.It's communication and I think Right some great lines my I suppose my very first boss when I was a bit said to me was he said to me people are often having the right conversations with the wrong people and and that really stuck with me.
It's really stuck with me over my entire career that yeah often, you know, you're having these thoughts and ideas, but you're telling them to the wrong person go and have that conversation with the person that you need to have a conversation with and you'd be surprised what the outcome will be.That's cool.
I like that.I think I got it as a quote.He have the right conversation with the wrong person in your job could do your job and not that's the thing that you shouldn't do Hewitt.Yeah.
Your job will be all about communication to same same question as early as you just learn out of necessity or have you done any official communication training or any good books that you can recommend on it, or how do you get better at it?
Yeah, I think it's there are some great courses that are available.So I have done a negotiating course, which is Stingley with a lot more around communication than negotiating because I guess it all comes back to communication always but I would recommend a negotiation chords to most people because if I think by constantly negotiating in life and I actually completed the negotiation course through swinburne University down in Melbourne, but I'm sure that there are a number of Of great, you know similar business courses focusing on negotiation, but I just think it's interesting because when we step back and look at our lives, we're always negotiating with people personally and professionally and so it's good to know what you're negotiating style is when you're comfortable and when you're stressed, yeah get that my to go shade Styles Hammer.
That was a joke.I don't do that.So but yeah well for some people it is and that's okay, but it's really good to be aware.What you negotiating style is and know when you need to tailor it because that's part of good communication.But one of the things I think yes, my role at the moment is really focused on communication, but I think being a vet is in just generally speaking being a veterinarian is being a human is focused on good communication, but one of the things that I think really helped me as a veterinarian, but also in this role was being in a customer's customer-facing job when I was going through that school and that That's something I would highly recommend to any vet student omi's.
I always say, you know, if you're worried about how you're going to communicate when you're in practice get yourself into a customer facing role.Learn what the general public is like to deal with because that time things can be really challenging and get used to having some of those more challenging conversations so that when they come up in a professional setting you've got a bit more resilience around how to have those conversations.
So whether it's paid or volunteer, Entre highly recommend people to do customer service or customer facing roles.What did you do?Sorry when I wear when I worked in the animal shelter.I actually worked in the surrendering department.
So where people would surrender their animals that's a really tough place to her to work because you know people can sometimes surrender their animals for all sorts of reasons, but that's a really emotional place to work.And and I also worked in the adoption center.
So the flip side of it with you know, helping people find the ideal patched for them.But it was it was an interview that with interviewing people finding out what their lifestyle with life what they're looking for in a pet and then trying to educate them around what sort of animal would be best suited to them and that was that can be really challenging especially when people come in with a certain idea of what they want and and you've got a foot that on its head and convince them otherwise Yeah, I think that those those types of roles anything that gets you interacting with.
The general public is a really great thing to do.Especially for a bunch of people who generally teach the tale to be academics and and bookie sort of people who don't know it was going to make the generalization but they are certainly are a lot of veterinarians who are not naturally that way inclined.
That's that's really pretty great advice.But also, I mean how I don't know if you guys have this experience going through that school, but when I went through that school so many people said they wanted to be that because I didn't like interacting with people and Should I mean yeah, when you get out into the veterinary profession and you realize your entire job relies on good communication with people because if you cannot communicate with the pet owner, you ultimately can't achieve what you want to achieve for the pets help.
So it all boils down to communication at the end of the day.Yeah and negotiation again, isn't it?Because it isn't the click on the communication with pet owners kids very often be a case of negotiation.Absolutely you mentioned before Seven Habits of Highly Effective People by Stephen Covey.
As one of the books that you you liked.It was any other books that you or any other favorites that you come across that you think people should read?There is another one.It doesn't have the most appropriate title for you might already guess what it is.But yeah, that's a lot.
Yeah not giving a hurt say it say it so that that book is actually great.And that's I've really feel like that's a real lesson in you know, you've only got so much energy so weary where Are you going to put your energy in life?
You know, what?Are you going to choose to focus on and remembering that what you focus on is always your choice.Hmm.Now that's a really good story of Dolan type book.You just summarize it in one go.So, yeah, I wrote the blurb didn't you know, that was my take from it as well.
It's like you really have you only really have so many.Hoots to give about things I'll bet you really pick what you want to give two Hoots about so yeah, and that was just like there's all somewhat amazing stuff about value and competent and competition and and yeah, I suppose it's like Direction in life and so forth, but I think it's the key point is actually very powerful Point The Seven Habits of Highly Effective People.
I like rules number three and four and three years.Focusing on the thing the main thing what is your what is the main thing like you get drawn to different things different directions, but put first things first and number four, which is win win and I always try to think win-win in consoles.
How can I achieve a good outcome for the pet?How can I achieve good outcome for the client?How could I demonstrate value there?How could I be of service and in doing both those things, you know, we win as professional as well.So Yeah, awesome.
That's really cool.They're two great books.So yeah, I think they're brilliant.I think another piece of really great advice actually that my current line manager has given me and I've actually scheduled time in the diary for this every week now is you know, it's time just for reflection.
It's just it's just a pressed pause button on anything that might be going on around me.It's half an hour to an hour.I have a coffee with myself and I just touch base with myself, you know.How is everything going on the to do this for work?What's actually important?
What should I be focusing on but that it's a bit.You know that personal stuff II am I am I achieving what I want to achieve personally.Am I getting to the gym as often as I like am I catching up with the important people in my life as often as I like am I focusing on all the things that I want to be focusing on or have I gone awry because I think it's so easy to get swept up and get too busy and before you know, it week's turn into months and months turn into years.
Thin and I think it's important to check in with yourself.It's kind of like doing a regular Wheel of Life in yourself and rechecking the core areas of your life and what your rank and and you're actually doing the things which are important for you Hubert has one question the old and I still want to go back to this.
Let's keep it do you do this?Do you write it down when you do this these let's call it.Well it did you learn or do you just sit and Ponder and think about it?
I don't write it down.I just sit and Ponder and think about it.I have I have a whole like I have a couple of goals and I'm trying to achieve for work.I have a couple of personal goals that I've set myself and they're not you know, New Year's resolutions that you know their ongoing ways that I want to live.
What do I want to be doing every day and and I just check in with myself and it's one Wake and it's actually really calming experience.So it doesn't doesn't make me feel like anxious or you know, even if I find that I've been working on something giving too much of my energy and time to something perhaps isn't that important?
It doesn't make me anxious about it just makes me go I can just get that away then and so it's actually a very calming experience and and I look I look forward to that that time it's in my calendar as it's called me time.I'm very original.No, but but yeah, I look forward to that in my calendar because my work calendar will bring at me when I need to set that time aside.
So yeah, I'm asking about writing it down.I am I heard advice one's about about journaling.I did it daily daily journaling and I and I tried but I failed at the turning it into a habit, but I do and that that I wrote down and I'll do a similar thing to you, but not not scheduled it.
It's mostly when I just feel completely overwhelmed and I have to sit down and literally write it down.So you can see how bad is that I think is actually going and yeah, and that actually the writing down of it to me is almost therapeutic because then I started writing plans and and what what am I going to do about this that in this but there are examples also good because then occasionally I look back to it.
It's a six months later you look back to it.And then it's a very nice way to go.Yeah.I'm doing all right there.Actually, that's that thing.I'm worried about is we all all the things that I could like.Look at him go off completely forgotten about that.So it could be silly or like I feel like I'm not spending enough time with with the kids doing fun things.
And then I don't literally yesterday.I found one of those entries in my in my in my don't Circle that a diary I just scribble stuff down and I looked at and I went yeah that's not changed.I've totally failed on that the last six months ago.I need to do really make the better priority.
It's all Quick quick quick and and doing things with them that I have to do but no fun.So it's nice to actually be able to to use it everything down as to score yourself and how you go.You're going.Yeah.Oh, yeah.Absolutely.
I think I had bath my dog on the left week after week after week after week and jump.Yeah.He's starting to become quite offensive to the fences and then I thought okay this I've got a priority.I've got a little Terrier.
He's 14.Oh shit, I've had him for about a year is a little rescue and he loves rolling in anything disgusting at the dog park.So he truly needs bath regularly.But yeah, there you go.So might not seem that important but is it's pretty important pretty important in an apartment.
It's very important.So that's probably a good place to wrap it up Gerardo.If it now we can get to the question you were alluding to earlier.You got anything else to add tirado?No.No, I totally believe that either do it when you really need to or sometimes you do it in the schedule that I call it the Wheel of Life only because I'm down on myself and I have a wheel which let essentially has the main areas of my life work Health family finances.
So forth and I rate myself mildly wheel.I don't know.Actually I'm here but I don't know if I relationship and what work-life balance means for me and I have a wheel for my professor like my my job and actually the areas in my job like surgery medicine imagery and so forth and I kind of real it all out and like eight eight slices to the pie and What do I want to focus on next?
I really don't like the feeling of not knowing where I want to approve next.I really do like focusing on an area.I don't like being a generalist.I kind of like mmmm.Okay, this is time now ultrasound.So I did the ultrasound six months an ultrasound and I just focus on ultrasound so but yeah, so but going back to that the one questions you would with you always ask which I think is a great question.
Yeah, so, you know, you're at a Congress and you've got pretty much the whole world.As new graduates sitting in front of you listening listening to you and you've got a couple of minutes to give him just one bit of advice.What what's it going to be?I thought the previous question was Heavy.
No look I think.I think what's important to remember is that you know going back to what we discussed earlier.The industry is going through some change at the moment.And and I know that speaking to Veterinary students recently.They have mentioned to me that they feel as though perhaps there's a lot of negative attention on the veterinary profession that you know, it's all it's all hard.
Yakka and it's all going to be very tough and there's a lot of Veteran mental health mental health issues ETC and I think that's not to be ignored and that's obviously very important.But what I would say to a roomful of new graduates is that this isn't awesome profession to be a part of whether you're in clinical practice, whether you're an industry like me or in government or whatever.
It might be.It is an awesome profession to be a part of rural industry for the same reason which is that we care about the health of animals and the welfare of animals and at the end of the day your Veterinary degree is your golden ticket that will take you all over.
For the world and across various career paths and I would absolutely take every opportunity that you feel is right for you that comes your way and don't be afraid to try something different.You know, really that whole concept of trust your journey.
I think really resonates with me because I think everybody will have a very different Veterinary career path and certainly from the outset you think you're going to be a small animal medicine Specialist or a Cow Vettel whatever it might be and it changes every time anyone I speak to it changes significantly for them for the second that they leave at school.
So I would say keep an open mind take the opportunities that feel right for you and and just grow yourself both as a person and a veterinarian.Excellent.Thank you very much.
Okay, and welcome back and welcome to the smash addiction.We hope you enjoyed the broadcast like several of our guests before Minister spoke about the importance of scheduling time for regular reflection about where you are in life and in your career as well as the importance of occasionally stepping away from your everyday life to enable you to take a bird's-eye view of your situation.
I don't think that many of us need to be convinced of the importance of holidays.But what we do need to keep in mind is that it is To try to put some time aside during any break that you do take to do some self assessment for me this often happens with the notebook on my lap on the flight back from holiday and it often ends up with the embryo of a plan for where next other day after you've removed yourself from The Daily Grind.
It can be a really good time to ask yourself some questions.Like how do you feel about the way you're heading in life?And what can you do about it?If you don't feel like going back to work stop and explore that feeling is this just normal bow tie?That a blues or other deeper reasons for these feelings.
If there is a genuine desire not to go back and we've all been there then try to write down the reasons why and what you can do about it.What are the steps that you can take to fix it?So go ahead and book that time of you have our permission.I also loved would mean a said about how change does not always need to be in a total career change how you can sometimes create change right where you are consider whether you can work on changing some of the things that make you unhappy in your current.
Situation remember it starts with one or two steps and then as for those more regular smaller chicks that Mina talked about Gerardo.I know that you are a big fan of this.How often do you do this?And how do you go about it?Yes you but I'm a big fan of regular checks and it's only because I've had traumatic I would you say improvements in my productivity, but also how I feel about where I'm Ting there's it's clearer.
So the first step was doing a wheel of life and we talked about that in a previous podcast and we have we can tag a resource in the show notes.So they gave me a bit of an idea of where I felt like I needed to work more on and then what I do in what I've done at the start of the year was actually do a whole year plan of the things that I wanted to achieve by the end of the year.
So I look at I think about where I want to be Or if it came to New Year's one year later, what would a successful outcome look like for me?And what are the things I want to achieve and then I work backwards from that and break it down.And then what I do is I have like a weekly plan and then I have a daily plan and I'm a real big fan of morning planners where I ask myself.
Like I said ten questions which are like, what would be a great outcome for the day?What are the three core tasks I need to do today.What is the situation?That if it arose so what is the situation that I'm going to be in which could cause me stress?How do I need to be in that particular situation?
And who do I need to bring my a game on for they could be one person that really needs me to be focused present at energized or whatever.So my morning plan has helped me be the person I really want to be for the day and then that rolls into I recheck every week on Fridays where I scheduled my week moving forward and I reflect upon that and See how I'm tracking for reaching my successful outcome of the end of the year.
I also rely on other people to help me keep accountable and I do actually have a coach and Coach keeps me into on track.But also make sure that I am stretching myself because I could be quite relaxed and let myself go but I coach is really important in order to keep me accountable.
Keep me on track.Make sure I'm personally developing myself and doing Will crave challenge said doing hard things doing hard things that I can be step up into bigger and better things moving forward.I'm fascinated by your by the coach thing.
I can see a lot of value in that and I think that one day we'll have to do a little mini episode where we just just talk about that and how do you go about that?But I think it'll it'll go to long for this one, but I we left have to revisit that topic.I'll try to be more concise next time.
No, no.No, it was not a dig at me and it also talks about learning more about public speaking for her job.Now you might think well, I'm not going to be presenting any time soon.
So there's no benefit for me.But the reality is that most of us in this profession are constantly presenting and negotiating and that getting better at public speaking can be a great benefit to all of us.Even if you never go near a stage, so how do I or how did I get or start to feel more comfortable with public speaking?
Well, I started really small and you know, I focused on the things that I felt competent and confident in so and that's the way that actually we do it at an emergency service.We get the speakers to select topic that they feel comfortable in then they presented to their peers and they presented it to a small audience of Of referring veterinarians and then they learn a new topic and slowly what happens they develop a process from around it and they start to develop a ritual around it and then things to start become more automatic and habitual than at the think about it says lesser think about so then the speaking just occurs.
Then what happens is you start to folks with more on technique get feedback ask for feedback.But then you get then once you start getting feedback, then you can start to then set the intentions.How do I want to be?When I present this way, when I stand up for this group of people, what is the The energy they want to bring what is the emotion?
What is the feeling that I want to generate?Then?What happens is you can then roll in all the resources YouTube videos books.There's a good book that I read that Alex got me, which was Ted Talks and how to deliver a TED talk and then things like toast marks Toastmasters, which then give you some more structured feedback.
So start small talk about something you're really not.No about presented to people who are you feel comfortable talking to then build up the audience presented it to another group of people then select a different topic get B will be mindful of what you need to do to prepare develop a ritual around it make it habit then set intentions around the person you want to be or the way the style you want to deliver then ask feedback and then continue that sort of circle process and then soon you'll find that you feel comfortable.
I always feel Nervous actually presenting in front of people, but actually what I do now is I know that nervous this results in me getting tightness of breath.So if I focus on making sure that I don't feel tight in my chest then I'm able to reframe that nervousness into excitement and then I just kind of jiggle my body a bit and get energized and Bam ready to rock and roll and that's it for another episode of the vet fold.
I hope that you feel more enlightened about the world of technical veterinarians.And that you enjoyed Mina's podcast as much as we did if you liked it.Remember to tell three of your friends who you think may also enjoy it and also to leave us a five-star review.
You guys are champions go smash it.
That was perfect.That was perfect.

Dr Mina Hamilton